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The event "The Assault on Taekir" is beginning in 1 day, 9 hours.

Improving skills/spells

 
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Multore



Joined: 06 Feb 2015
Posts: 32

PostPosted: Sun Nov 20, 2016 1:13 pm    Post subject: Improving skills/spells

I stumbled across this feature while surfing through some other MUDs. This place is the closest to my original place that I can find so I always end up back here, despite some features I dislike. That being said, I find every time I come back, I have to spend a lot of time with the boring things like skill ups. I dislike spending copious amounts of time on a character that has a finite life span. That is one of my biggest hurdles here, since most places you invest time in a character that will last.

The feature I saw from another place was an interesting take on this skill up system. The command was called 'improve' and it allowed a character to focus their attention on one particular skill/spell. While this focus was in place they would periodically have a skill/spell improvement just like when they spam the skill.

It worked on timers associated with the skill - so a more difficult skill would require a longer time frame between skill ups. The times would work while online or off line (to a lesser degree). That was the only method of skill improvement on that MUD but I think here it would be a welcomed addition to the current spam methods to have a steady trickle of skill improvements just for being logged in and could encourage continued play of a character if they knew that there were slight improvements happening even while off line, provided they select an improvement to focus on. The skill up system gave a random percentage each time it was triggered.

Thanks,
Multore - giving this place another try, again.
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Olyn
Immortal


Joined: 23 Jul 2008
Posts: 3244
Location: Pennsylvania

PostPosted: Sun Nov 20, 2016 3:35 pm    Post subject:

Thanks for the idea. I want to point out that we have a number of features to make training easier. You can learn from your groupmates and learn from your opponents in battle. We also have guild rewards, quest rewards, and surges to improve training rates. We have the dummy for spamming. When you say you want to 'focus' on a skill, that seems like you would just use that skill. i.e. you stop kicking dirt and use disarm if you want to train disarm. I don't think there will ever be a place for offline skill improvements on AR.

tl;dr
I think it makes more sense to improve the skill when you're actually using it, not when you wish you were better at it.
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Multore



Joined: 06 Feb 2015
Posts: 32

PostPosted: Sun Nov 20, 2016 4:17 pm    Post subject:

Yeah, I don't think it matters much. Every time I come back I realize that the attitudes of some people are what usually drive me away from the game.

That and the lack of ability to truly invest in a a character since it ultimately dies regardless of how much time and effort you put into it. That concept is very unappealing to me as well. I thought if I could offer ways to expedite the tedious portions of the game I may be able to overcome the fact that I cannot invest long term in any of my characters. I am not sure that is the case for me.
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Ozaru



Joined: 01 Jun 2010
Posts: 1073

PostPosted: Sun Nov 20, 2016 4:47 pm    Post subject:

I agree with you Multore, what is annoying is all the things that immortals put in place to make the game easier, but completely overlook mages. Sure I can level up to 50 with a necro or illusionist in 8 hours because that is where the "fun" is. However to be competitive I need to create triggers to sleep for 480 seconds to get what twenty blinds off and see it increase a few percentage points in 40 hours training. Where I master blind, but the monk next to me mastered 20 skills its a joke.

Melee characters can sit at the dummy and master everything necessary and as a mage life is infinitely harder, why does this game have to be so hard lol? Just look at the minutes played, overwhelming majority of players are not spell casters because the effort involved isn't worth it. Give players the incentive to play mages, spell craft seemed interesting and I thought it worked like if I cast blind then cast dispel magic, I have a much higher chance of improving the next spell. No one seems to understand that if that is the case and honestly it doesn't work if that is how the spell should work.

For the record I am still happy playing dota 2 instead of this mud. I logged in using the website to see 4 immortals and 3 players including myself..... Yeah not good lol
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Vanisse
Immortal


Joined: 06 Jan 2006
Posts: 2793
Location: inside a tree

PostPosted: Sun Nov 20, 2016 6:17 pm    Post subject:

Snark aside, I appreciate that you spent time away from here and care enough to come back and post some helpful feedback either here on forums and/or directly to me in game. However much any of you (all players) might think you are shouting into a void when you post this kind of stuff, you're not. I can't speak for the other imms but to me, receiving your live feedback, be it ideas or criticisms, is really motivating. There is a huge backlog of issues that needs tackling in addition to the stuff you guys suggest and I feel like Sisyphus most of the time. Knowing it matters to somebody and that you guys care about this place helps. Seeing things from different perspectives is important. Keep it coming.
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Ergorion



Joined: 16 Mar 2007
Posts: 2156

PostPosted: Mon Nov 21, 2016 1:30 am    Post subject:

To Ozaru's point about mages: spamming spells is the easiest thing in the world. Sure it's boring as hell but wicked easy.
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Merlandox



Joined: 31 Mar 2016
Posts: 258

PostPosted: Mon Nov 21, 2016 5:34 pm    Post subject:

I do agree that training skills is way faster than training spells. Things are so much easier to train now.

To Ozaru, it is not true that you need huge hours to be competitive. Sure spells fail, but it can be dealt with. A good example is Azhai, he has what? barely 10hrs (somewhere there) when he hit 50 and he was destroying everyone there.

Sure, I would like things to be easier too, but where's the stop line? We seem to be going towards not training at all and the IMMS just give us 100% outright.

My suggestion to Multore, you don't have to train every single skill to 100%. You can slowly train when you have the time. Just identify certain core spells/skills for each class and train them. The rest is a bonus. If you do it in surge with other players, you can probably get most of the core skills/spells up in 2-3 surges and you're competitive.

The one spell that I can think of which is a pain in the ass is animate corpse for necromancers. Seriously, I think we need to do something about it. Nobody's gonna play necromancers if we only have 2hrs a day to play. If you're unlucky you won't even get your zombies. It's a little too painful to play necromancers.
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Xenyar
Emissary


Joined: 26 May 2010
Posts: 596

PostPosted: Mon Nov 21, 2016 7:39 pm    Post subject:

Appreciate the suggestion, Multore...but I have absolutely no issue with skills or spell training. It's easier than it has ever been before and the imms have done quite a bit to make it that way. Olyn hit all the training points already so I wont.
Each char has 61 deaths, not counting deaths during surges that don't go toward that 61. Very rarely does anybody con die.
I could literally keep a fully invested 20-30 hr/month char for several , several years before I reached con death. That may still be be finite, but to me that's the closest thing to infinite that there can be. Point is, 99.9% of chars get deleted or not used so they auto-delete anyways after a handful of months. My character investment lasts as long as I want it to last...and then I delete because it's time to move on to the next project.
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Vanisse
Immortal


Joined: 06 Jan 2006
Posts: 2793
Location: inside a tree

PostPosted: Mon Nov 21, 2016 8:29 pm    Post subject:

From the discussion I had yesterday with Multore here were the main concerns/suggestions:

1) longevity of characters - not really a real issue I can see. Aside from the almost non-issue of condying in current AR, the present combination of Herald stuff, backgrounds, player interactions/logs, etc make it possible to have a long-lasting if not eternal imprint on the game.

2) lack of safe rooms - having one could be useful, it's been discussed on another thread somewhere and I think it was kind of evenly split on for/against. One of the taverns could be used for that. Adrenaline check on entry. Character could be in stasis while in the safe space (no aging, no passive skill gains, nothing - just RP interactions). RP abuse moderated by imms/Heralds (bouncer to boot out).

3) negative energy on forums - I agree that is a problem when it happens, though we do try to mod away excessively flamey posts. Can work on this.

4) feeling of isolation - Multore suggested more global channels in addition to newbie chat. I feel opposed to a global OOC channel but wouldn't really mind if gossip was opened to all, since you can toggle it off. Could even use the global channel to announce people entering/exiting the tavern again. We would just need to come up with a different perk for patrons.
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Ozaru



Joined: 01 Jun 2010
Posts: 1073

PostPosted: Tue Nov 22, 2016 12:22 am    Post subject:

Making a reference that you don't need to master spells and you can destroy people is irresponsible to the other players in this mud. Illusionists are the one class that doesn't depend heavily on magic to kill easy targets since you can get your best dups in about 5 minutes and if you fail you just wait 20 minutes and start again. Hell even I killed people with an illusionist its not hard.

Now go try that as a lvl 50 necro or shaman or invoker with 10 hours play time see how well you do when you fail animate corpse or blow 200 mana on failing spells just to prep for a fight not counting the spells you need to actually kill someone.

Again the point multore is making with spell and skill training is that you don't have to touch your key board to train skills, with spells you do and its a pain in the ass to have to do it.
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Nycticora



Joined: 09 Feb 2013
Posts: 2277

PostPosted: Tue Nov 22, 2016 2:42 am    Post subject:

channeling should help with that most of the time, that's what it was intended to facilitate
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