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The event "The Assault on Taekir" is beginning in 1 day, 5 hours.

PK rock paper scissors 2015
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m1coftw



Joined: 05 May 2015
Posts: 265

PostPosted: Fri Jun 05, 2015 10:51 pm    Post subject: PK rock paper scissors 2015

From all the chars I have rolled and PK'd with imo, this is how this breaks down (Solely mechanic vs mechanic, with equal skill and eq):

CASTERS:

Illus > Necros, invokers, thieves, shadows, shamans, healers, monks, paladins, DKS

Illus < rangers, bards, serkers

Necros > thieves, shadows, shamans, healers, paladins, dks, monks, non-giant serkers

Necros < illus, bards, certain serkers, rangers

Invokers > thieves, shadows, fire warriors, low hp warriors/rangers (elves etc), bards, monks, healers, shamans

Invokers < illus, necros, serkers, paladins, dks,

FIGHTERS:

Warriors > necros, thieves, shadows, bards, invokers, illus

Warriors < serkers, shamans, dks, paladins, monks, healers

Berserkers > thieves, shadows, invokers, rangers, healers, shamans, illus, dks, paladins

Berserkers < necros, bards, HGOD

Rangers > Shamans, healers, thieves, shadows, bards, invokers, illus

Rangers < Necros, serkers, monks


ROGUES:

Shadows > thieves, bards

Shadows < rest

Thieves > themselves

Thieves < all


HYBRIdS:

Paladins > warriors, thieves, shadows, shamans, monks, invokers, bards

Paladins < serkers, healers, illus, necros, rangers

DKS > warriors, thieves, shadows, shamans, healers, monks, invokers, bards, serkers, rangers

DKS < necros, illus



Feel free to discuss/correct it.
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DoomAlone



Joined: 05 Jun 2015
Posts: 11

PostPosted: Tue Jun 09, 2015 7:23 pm    Post subject:

Invoker > Shaman? Wow...the world I knew is gone...

The main thing I take from this is that you see rogues in general and thieves in particular as underpowered. Care to elaborate on that?
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Kato



Joined: 03 Nov 2013
Posts: 219

PostPosted: Tue Jun 09, 2015 7:29 pm    Post subject:

I don't think m1co is correct about all of this. Shamans and healers will crap on invokers if they don't fuck up, especially now that slow was nerfed. I'd put invokers solidly above fire warriors, and at a disadvantage against everyone else.

Rogues are also off. If you're using an arena fight as your metric, sure -- rogues will get stomped. But situationally, rogues can become very strong. Shadow is the only class that has a chance to kill literally ANYONE - with hide, they can pick their battles easily and only engage when they have an advantage or land a strangle.

Also stuff like berserker > healer is silly, healers clearly have the advantage there.

Prognosis - good start, but by no means is this a set of refined comparisons
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m1coftw



Joined: 05 May 2015
Posts: 265

PostPosted: Tue Jun 09, 2015 7:48 pm    Post subject:

This was more of a toe-to-toe comparison. As I said with equal skill and no surprise/outplaying elements.
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Ozaru



Joined: 01 Jun 2010
Posts: 1073

PostPosted: Tue Jun 09, 2015 8:50 pm    Post subject:

Im no second grader but can u explain this:

Necros < illus, bards, certain serkers, rangers

Rangers < Necros, serkers, monks
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m1coftw



Joined: 05 May 2015
Posts: 265

PostPosted: Tue Jun 09, 2015 9:47 pm    Post subject:

It was not supposed to be there, I had something else in mind, can't recall what it was right now.
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DoomAlone



Joined: 05 Jun 2015
Posts: 11

PostPosted: Tue Jun 09, 2015 10:11 pm    Post subject:

"When a Necromancer dies his body becomes the grass, and the Rangers eat the grass. And so we are all connected in the great Circle of Life."

(Citing as precedent "Lions vs. Antelope" circa 1994)
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Nycticora



Joined: 09 Feb 2013
Posts: 2277

PostPosted: Tue Jun 09, 2015 10:16 pm    Post subject:

idk what that means but it sounded pretty dank
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m1coftw



Joined: 05 May 2015
Posts: 265

PostPosted: Tue Jun 09, 2015 10:23 pm    Post subject:

That just means that all the vegetarians are cannibals in disguise.
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DoomAlone



Joined: 05 Jun 2015
Posts: 11

PostPosted: Tue Jun 09, 2015 11:03 pm    Post subject:

That was how Mufasa rationalised and justified the slaughter of countless antelope by fallaciously suggesting that the relationship between lions and antelope is circular (as is apparently the case with necromancers and rangers, where necromancer > ranger > necromancer).

It definitely doesn't seem funny now... Sad

And anyone who doesn't get the reference didn't have a childhood.
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Ergorion



Joined: 16 Mar 2007
Posts: 2156

PostPosted: Wed Jun 10, 2015 12:48 am    Post subject:

Or we're all really old and/or young.
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m1coftw



Joined: 05 May 2015
Posts: 265

PostPosted: Wed Jun 10, 2015 12:50 am    Post subject:

THIS was my childhood, welcome
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Ashlyn



Joined: 20 Oct 2006
Posts: 280

PostPosted: Wed Jun 10, 2015 4:09 am    Post subject:

I don't really agree with this because even with equal skill and gear, situation has a lot to do with it. Say im fighting a Zerker, im not going to be out in the open and let him rage, im going to be summoning mobs or standing next to something big to fuck him over. With a necro im going to be summoning/killing zombies. etc.

You know what seems strong right now... Drow Shadow. With the racial as long as you can flee and don't get lagged to death after failing a strangle/ass and you're half competent you're fucking terrifying.
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Ashlyn



Joined: 20 Oct 2006
Posts: 280

PostPosted: Wed Jun 10, 2015 4:09 am    Post subject:

Also Healers> All
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m1coftw



Joined: 05 May 2015
Posts: 265

PostPosted: Wed Jun 10, 2015 4:25 am    Post subject:

I have two words to say about a drow shadow: hobble, buddyslam.

I rest my case
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Andrael



Joined: 15 Jan 2013
Posts: 779

PostPosted: Wed Jun 10, 2015 6:52 am    Post subject:

I want someone to make a berzerker and have them make a thing where they yell "BUDDY!" if they start fight with a bodyslam
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Davairus
Implementor


Joined: 16 Jan 2004
Posts: 10344
Location: 0x0000

PostPosted: Wed Jun 10, 2015 7:21 am    Post subject:

invoker < paladin .
haha
mana shield and dispel magic say hi
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m1coftw



Joined: 05 May 2015
Posts: 265

PostPosted: Wed Jun 10, 2015 4:53 pm    Post subject:

saves and physical/magic weapon, say hi
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Faelon
Emissary


Joined: 23 Feb 2006
Posts: 938
Location: Your moms house.

PostPosted: Wed Jun 10, 2015 5:16 pm    Post subject:

Only invoker I ever had a problem with on Marest was Raqaz. Primarily because of slow and perma-flight through scrolls. With those two things, he just ran through doors and caught ticks for 150hp gains, to come back again.

Now, with slow debuffed for hp, invokers may have jumped the other direction.
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Andrael



Joined: 15 Jan 2013
Posts: 779

PostPosted: Wed Jun 10, 2015 6:28 pm    Post subject:

Raqas was a quasit, so he flew naturally.
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