Chaos cabal. Potential?

[Nycticora]

Legion tags don't seem to show up in the active player list

[Mikoos]

The hormonal teenager cabal. An organization to end all organizations? Is Legion getting no love these days or something?

[Rayor]

Justice can be boring, sure. But in all fairness, there isn't anything holding people back from making an aggressive Justice. Maybe not being able to invade other cabals(unless they are wanted), and just the general town protection. I think the last relatively aggressive person in Justice was m1co for crying out loud. He did it pretty solid(hopefully he doesn't read this), but did his typical delete early routine.

As for a Chaos Cabal. I think it would certainly bring a certain flavor to Justice, there is no denying it. I personally don't have much to say for ideas as for what abilities they could gather though as of now. As they come to me I'll try to throw them up here.

[Nycticora]

Not all characters can be in Legion though Mikoos. Like what if you're a chaotic neutral warrior who drinks too much and thinks the government is conspiring against him or a chaotic good invoker who blames Justice for the death of a relative during an apprehension

two characters we'll probably never see as long as everyone sits around with their thumbs up their asses complaining that they have nothing to do

[divsky]

The goals of this cabal seem too closely aligned to Legion. Isn't it already Legion's job to spread death and disorder? I'm sure someone will argue the semantics but if your only objective as a Cabal is to randomly PK people then it's essentially Legion 2.0.

[Ergorion]

There's a big difference between power and chaos.

[Xenyar]

Agree with Ergorion...agree with Divsky. Never thought Keepers had a real relevance.. made that point years ago when they were released. Hey you pk too well, I'll fight you and make living wood look like I'm fairly decked and kill you with my average 27 hell-spear or whatever..

Some may not like my point that it would thin out the other cabals. But that's a valid point, dislike it or not.
-From previous threads, it seems what the people want is one cabal char per player for the sake of roleplay/immersion. If that indeed does happen, opening up another cabal really would thin out the current cabals, and make it tough for all of us to vote the one cabal char per player idea for the sake of each cabals population.
-Cabal warfare is something else people have mentioned. Right now cabal warfare is 1v1 or 1v2, mainly. Pretty sad. Adding another cabal would only add to the lacking of group cabal fights.

Lorne, adding good contest is a good thing.. sure. Just because it's a good concept to some, doesn't mean its a good fit.

From what I see, adding another cabal would go against two things the people want, whether it be directly or indirectly.

[Davairus]

Ergorion has put it basically the way I see it too.. there is Knight vs Legion, and Justice vs ThisCabal. They are on the opposite axes of their respective ethos (good vs evil, order vs chaos). Traditionally, chaos has been considered "bad" and order considered "good" in our history.

Keeper remains IMPORTANT and relevant as an agent that is kind of a bystander's cabal that just goes after cabals that have become jerkfaces without really taking any moral sides. I don't see how this cabal could impact Keeper whatsoever since it is literally orthogonal. Nor does the lack of numbers overall particularly worry me.


It actually looks like Warlords could step straight into the role since they are already based out of town. The theme fits them very well fundamentally. Everybody seems to want a purpose for Warlords, and here it is right under your noses. No new cabal required, just reduction perfectum. If you would like to see the Warlords become playable dragon worshipping barons of chaos that we already know and love from doing winter runs, give me a fucking hell yeah. And if that doesnt make you hard for rolling a warlord I dont know what could. I'll be first in line for hitting strike of the cobra on justices, cracking skulls and wrecking yo shit

[Mikoos]

Alright as long as Legion is getting some love, I'm happy.

I could easily see Warlords doing this as well. "returning the world to before the age of civilizations." Feels like them in a way...but I could also see Keepers doing it.

Personally I'd play a Keeper more often maybe even 1/2 the time I play. If one of their powers succeeded more often instead of failing constantly. Could have been the stats I played with, but I dunno. And if the threat flag had the same consequences of at war.

[Merlandox]

Yeah, that's something I don't understand too. Why do threats not have the same consequence as at war?

[Ergorion]

I think giving warlords a dragon-worshiping chaos-streak to fit this new cabal roll would be good for them. I do think this chaos cabal needs either incentives to become wanted or immunity from special guards/the usual wanted bullshit.

I disagree about the importance and relevance of keepers. I think if we have one caballed character per player. And this knight/legion; justice/warlord dichotomy balance will find itself fairly readily without keepers. As is, I think keepers actually hinder true balance amongst cabals.

I agree with Xenyar about the concern about diluted cabals. 5 cabals is too many for the current playerbase to support. Rather than blow available players on a cabal that inefficiently works to "balance" the swing of power, I think balance would occur more organically and efficiently with players freely choosing from the four cabals and having alliances amongst those cabals as needed.

In a state of perfect equilibrium, Justice would come into conflict primarily with Warlords. Knights would come into conflict primarily with Legion. In the event that one of those two relationships came out of balance, I would predict that aid would be given to the weaker party by the stronger of the other pair and bring things closer to balance.

The problem with Keepers being keepers of balance is that since they switch sides so often, everyone ends up hating them. Instead of everyone being a potential friend for them, everyone ends up being their enemy. With the four cabal setup, I think alliances and shifts of power would be more gradual and the sting of defeat would have time to wear off so that shifts in alliance would happen more naturally and to better effect.

[Lorne]

The argument of how keepers are on an orthogonal plane compared to Knight/Legion can be used for Warlords as well. The chaos theory you have here don't fit with current Warlord ideologies. Warlords have always been self-discipline, perfection in fighting, honor etc. I mean yes, I agree when deathmarks start being handed and heads roll it causes some chaos but's totally an indirect cause. This is not part of Warlord fundamentals imo.

The player list is missing Legion and Warlord tags so it's a bit inaccurate. My stance on the Keeper class aside, I do like the potential of more chaos being incorporated in the cabals...just not exactly sure where.

Also, I like the add there are more chaos ethos players merely by the fact they can PK freely without any RP backlash. Lawfuls are obviously barred from fighting in the protected cities, neutrals have much more variability but if they become overly "vengeful" without proper reason can get some backlash as history has shown. Also, chaotics get to use some pretty sick wild weapons to boot as an extra incentive. With religions, I don't think you need to be chaotic to kill whoever you want to kill obviously.

[asudan]

Justice took a hard nose dive when the cabal was moved

[Davairus]

Current "warlord" is causing clamor for change. you know where else there is clamor? Nemhhael Gonturans room, where he is wearing the vorpal of atonement, a.k.a.chaotic rape stick.
Maybe auto-hitting forms on special guards will help adjust your perspective.


There are no plans to change or remove the Keeper cabal.

[Lorne]

I wish vorpal was chaotic, I'd be hoarding that alllll dayyy.

Yes, more suped guards, that indeed might change my perspective )

[Trojal]

I understand the appeal of having ThisCabal designed in opposition to Justice, but that will just make a 1 [cabal] vs 1 [cabal] in Legion vs Knights and a 1v1 in Justice vs ThisCabal.

In my opinion, 1v1s are boring. 1v1v1s are more fun and somewhat self-balancing. For example, if ThisCabal were opposed to both Knights and Legion (instead of Justice), seeking the return of the Chaos Dragon or the Fell by murdering Legion and Knight members...

[Ergorion]

Trojal I think those 1v1 arrangements will lead to alliances to make it 2v1. Then 2v2. And if one cabal gets uber powerful could even go 3v1.

[Davairus]

Its just chaotic, whether that is antithetical to justice is besides the point, theyll have everybody to fight.

[Multore]

Also consider the fact that if the Chaos cabal is open to anyone who is chaotic that would include all three spheres of good, neutral, evil. This alone would draw attention from both Knights and Legion.

Knights are not picky on which evil they squash nor are Legion picky about anyone not Legion good or otherwise. Another evil organization could be perceived as a threat or merely an inconvenience to be dealt with.

Chaos would not necessarily align with any one clan since it would have multiple facets within itself. It could easily end up similar to Keeper with a revolving door of enemies due to it's unpredictable nature.

[Lorne]

Huh?

Can't warlords and justices both be good, neutral and evil?

Durrrrr.