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[2018 Q1] random savage weapons
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tayyah



Joined: 20 May 2011
Posts: 597

PostPosted: Mon Jan 15, 2018 12:48 am    Post subject: [2018 Q1] random savage weapons

come on... there has to be a better system for this. I got tired of getting a whip on my dk
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Olyn
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Joined: 23 Jul 2008
Posts: 3244
Location: Pennsylvania

PostPosted: Sat Feb 24, 2018 1:38 pm    Post subject:

How does everyone else feel about this?
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beia



Joined: 18 Mar 2006
Posts: 920
Location: Texas

PostPosted: Sat Feb 24, 2018 2:42 pm    Post subject:

I like the old way better. I would like some understanding as to why it was changed.
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Davairus
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Joined: 16 Jan 2004
Posts: 10344
Location: 0x0000

PostPosted: Sat Feb 24, 2018 11:08 pm    Post subject:

kato/someone said they're too easy to get. So we added a random element of chance.
I think its fine as is. I would say maybe only just separate out the levl 50 and levl 45 ones.
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tayyah



Joined: 20 May 2011
Posts: 597

PostPosted: Sat Feb 24, 2018 11:41 pm    Post subject:

how about this... revert it back to the old way of having a choice but put it in evermore beside the lucky smuggler or something, than its no different than the battlesmith who sells the average 22 non rare non wild weapons
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beia



Joined: 18 Mar 2006
Posts: 920
Location: Texas

PostPosted: Sun Feb 25, 2018 3:01 am    Post subject:

I don't think its fine at all, it gives berserkers and rangers weapons they can't use. Its silly.
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Andrael



Joined: 15 Jan 2013
Posts: 779

PostPosted: Sun Feb 25, 2018 5:20 am    Post subject:

have it check for weapon skills before you get the weapon? Only get weapons you can use?
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Kedaleam
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Joined: 25 Mar 2006
Posts: 989
Location: Michigan

PostPosted: Sun Feb 25, 2018 7:33 am    Post subject:

Or just put them on the weapon vendor in Winter if it's something about not wanting them to be too easily accessible? I didn't like how I got a savage whip 10 times in a row, that's for sure. But I typically avoid chaotic characters so maybe I don't know much about it.
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Lorne
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Joined: 20 Jan 2004
Posts: 456

PostPosted: Sun Feb 25, 2018 1:29 pm    Post subject:

I think I was the first to suggest making it random. I thought it was pretty bullshit you can just re-equip your whole weapon arsenal with already "mid-rare" range weapons by just withdrawing 50-70k coins from your bank.

We're talking about avg 21-22 NON-RARE wild weapons, all with decent hit/dam attached you can get all the time.

I felt alot of the mid-range rare weapons were no longer utilized because of this, like who even looks at the spider blades and withering scythes anymore? That's just Darkhaven alone.

These savage weapons get over-utilized too much, and makes alot of the other rare weapons unremarkable which makes you lazy and not interesting. I mean they are almost just as good as justice and knight weapons, and these guys have to earn their rank and cabal to get those.

This is speaking from a guy that almost always plays chaotic characters and abuses these weapons.
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beia



Joined: 18 Mar 2006
Posts: 920
Location: Texas

PostPosted: Sun Feb 25, 2018 3:01 pm    Post subject:

Is getting back on the battlefield is something we are trying to avoid? You are taking time away from pvp forcing us to farm mid range low level trash rare weapons rather than grab the currency we farmed to get weapons and get back into the fight. It’s bullshit. If anything lower there average damage slightly making them just good enough and worth the gold. Go ahead and check how many times that place has been used since it was changed. Might as well remove it altogether.
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Nycticora



Joined: 09 Feb 2013
Posts: 2277

PostPosted: Mon Feb 26, 2018 4:24 am    Post subject:

there's a minimum investment level below which dying isn't meaningful enough and people don't get the fear
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Ergorion



Joined: 16 Mar 2007
Posts: 2156

PostPosted: Mon Feb 26, 2018 10:19 am    Post subject:

It still takes a decent chunk of time to get mal beast or regal radiance. I agree that savage weapons should be back the way they were. If you’re worried about their power maybe tone them down to avg 19/20 instead of avg 22.
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Nycticora



Joined: 09 Feb 2013
Posts: 2277

PostPosted: Mon Feb 26, 2018 8:30 pm    Post subject:

malicious beast and regal radiance are trash sets that exist to handicap players who aren't good at the game

just going to throw that out there

this type of mechanic is called a "noob trap"

it is possible to use malicious beast to kill other players and take their stuff if you are better than they are. I don't expect to see many players doing this. You can do the same thing with a shaman staff or curved long sword, this just gives the illusion of power via deceptively impressive damroll numbers

the fact that malicious beast is better than regal radiance might not surprise any of you, but some of you might be surprised to learn that malicious beast is trash

you are free to disagree with me and try to prove me wrong

it might be possible to engrave malicious beast on rares or gambleds such that you can mitigate its shortcomings, but I have yet to see this done
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Kedaleam
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Joined: 25 Mar 2006
Posts: 989
Location: Michigan

PostPosted: Mon Feb 26, 2018 9:44 pm    Post subject:

If I recall, the point of those sets is more geared towards the people who can’t put in the time to keep their rare stuff. Maybe I’m entirely wrong too however.
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Davairus
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Joined: 16 Jan 2004
Posts: 10344
Location: 0x0000

PostPosted: Mon Feb 26, 2018 10:45 pm    Post subject:

My thing with the sets, and you can check this for yourselves, don't take my word for it.

Consider a character who has the spiked steel arm braces (I think these are three dex?), lethal leather gloves and is therefore unable to wear malicious beast, so they get whatever normal stuff they can equip with their winter-tier shit. I dont know what, but red dragon shit probably.
Now consider a character who just wears malicious beast.

If you compare the characters youre probably going to see the malicous beast guy has a bigger damroll, a permanent infravision effect, hp and moves or whatever other shit, AND isn't a walking bullseye because he is wearing "whatever" eq that nobody wants from him. That's a lot of pro's.

Now I'm not saying that sets are the best equipment in the game by any means, but it can take a while to get the equipment to justify breaking them. And even when you finally do get strong enough rares to outdo the sets, well that barely matters anyway! You need to get over the hump of the set bonus and then something on top. So you might as well use them until you can get a good RDG off, or Winter, or gambled good items (tons of gold), in my opinion. Otherwise youre just asking to get picked off and your actual good items equipped by the people who are doing the pickings.

This is actually one more reason why the savage weapons were so lame. They're the treant thews of weaponry and they rot, which means youre able to go around trash pk'ing with no chance of strengthening your opponents by them looting you. ITs kind of the same with treant thews, you DO have a chance of victory against a guy with a couple rares on the line and you have nothing to lose. Its glorified goblin eq in my opinion.
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Nycticora



Joined: 09 Feb 2013
Posts: 2277

PostPosted: Tue Feb 27, 2018 1:58 am    Post subject:

eh I'd rather sink that effort into something like gambled equipment or an easy gank. The gambled eq doesn't lock you into a set that you'll need to weaken yourself to get out of. I guess it's good for noobs in that nobody else wants it so you won't get ganked for your eq, but in this day and age I think most ganks are going to happen for in character reasons rather than for eq
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Ceridwel
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Joined: 01 Feb 2008
Posts: 3385
Location: Seattle

PostPosted: Tue Feb 27, 2018 4:37 am    Post subject:

When I play goodies my default is Regal Radiance with certain pieces engraved. It rocks. I'm not a good enough pvp'r that were I to get TT or TC or whatever, I wouldn't lose it soon anyways. Knowing I can re-equip in my engraved RR in a few hours make me happy as a clam at high tide.
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Olyn
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Joined: 23 Jul 2008
Posts: 3244
Location: Pennsylvania

PostPosted: Tue Feb 27, 2018 5:08 pm    Post subject:

Metalsmith in winter has everything lvl 45 and cost 20k. I say we do the same with Darkhaven weapons and get rid of the random. Trash players can't afford the 20k very many times anyway.
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Nycticora



Joined: 09 Feb 2013
Posts: 2277

PostPosted: Wed Feb 28, 2018 1:15 am    Post subject:

I'm OK with this solution.

I do like the mechanism that dav incuded to the tester to produce the random weapons though

what if we make a back room you can enter and choose one weapon from the stockpile if you buy a pass from the mob that sells these? A wizimob could automatically kick you out when you pick something up in the room
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tayyah



Joined: 20 May 2011
Posts: 597

PostPosted: Sat Mar 24, 2018 1:26 pm    Post subject:

So, since alot of these changes have been implemented now, are we going to get to see a list?
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