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The event "The Assault on Taekir" is beginning in 18 hours, 34 mins.

Dispel magic change
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Davairus
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Joined: 16 Jan 2004
Posts: 10344
Location: 0x0000

PostPosted: Wed Jan 02, 2008 11:33 pm    Post subject:

Eh, that's worse than before, which was why I never responded - anyone who wants to fight shamans, would need one save solely to protect his sanc (afflictive, which is totally useless against the shaman damage spells, much like sanc is), mals to protect from blinds, some mentals to protect from the other stuff. Basically the shaman rapes them. Lets try to remember what goals we had in mind -- simpler saves for vs shamans so that they aren't so tuff.
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Mandor



Joined: 03 Mar 2006
Posts: 794

PostPosted: Sun Jan 06, 2008 9:39 am    Post subject:

Fine then what about this?

Spell - Dispel type
Sanctuary, armor - mal
Protective shield, protection - aff
haste, enlarge - mental
weapon ward - aff
detect invis/good/evil/magic - mental

just as an example. I for one really disliked having everything dispelled from a lucky dispel, and to avoid it you always wore 20+ mental against mages. dividing buffs into different spell type categories for the purposes of making dispel A. not so powerful anymore, as you wont be able to just load up on savebreak mental and dispel it all. B. it gives illusionists and invokers the perfect mal spell they need with regards to sanctuary being mal dispelled. It also makes dispel still a possibility for getting around someones weakly protected save vs in mental mal or aff, to hit them for removing some of their spells, which keeps dispel useful despite someone wearing saves, but certainly weakens it because it cant hit them all. I think this would add more tactical use to dispel magic.

a shaman prechange could get 1 good mental savebreak and wipe the floor with any class that uses a lot of support spells and was trying to save vs mal. they also could use a lesser more hp efficient savebreak mental to get around anything a warrior might have on.

This change seems to effectively shut all the caster classes down to me, from shamans to invokers.
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Davairus
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Joined: 16 Jan 2004
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 06, 2008 10:38 am    Post subject:

Dispel magic being "all or nothing" is not the case. It does have a high failure rate independent of the individual spell dispel attempts afterward. And thats what your save helps. But once its over that "hump", it no longer matters what saves you're wearing, so it does still seem to fluke-own people with high saves. That is, once your save is beaten, dispel magic does exactly the same thing as it would against no saves. It does not dispel *all* stuff. If it did people would never have gone saveless for the sake of having a chance at killing.
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Mandor



Joined: 03 Mar 2006
Posts: 794

PostPosted: Sun Jan 06, 2008 12:01 pm    Post subject:

Davairus wrote:
Dispel magic being "all or nothing" is not the case. It does have a high failure rate independent of the individual spell dispel attempts afterward. And thats what your save helps. But once its over that "hump", it no longer matters what saves you're wearing, so it does still seem to fluke-own people with high saves. That is, once your save is beaten, dispel magic does exactly the same thing as it would against no saves. It does not dispel *all* stuff. If it did people would never have gone saveless for the sake of having a chance at killing.


you will agree though that sanc is the most important thing for a mage to be able to dispel, and putting it in the same main spell type as invokers and illusionists makes them all or nothing spellcasters?
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Davairus
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 06, 2008 8:53 pm    Post subject:

Dispel was mental before so nothing changed for illusionist.
Necro is too versatile to matter.
Cleric is not even worth discussing.
Invoker is already discussed earlier in thread. They only suffer because of a lack of strategies to begin with.
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Mandor



Joined: 03 Mar 2006
Posts: 794

PostPosted: Sun Jan 06, 2008 10:56 pm    Post subject:

Davairus wrote:
Dispel was mental before so nothing changed for illusionist.
Necro is too versatile to matter.
Cleric is not even worth discussing.
Invoker is already discussed earlier in thread. They only suffer because of a lack of strategies to begin with.


yes, I disliked illusionists for that reason alone, but invoker was nearly in the same boat. I was just saying that dividing the buffs up for dispels in that manner would nerf shamans and buff invokers at the same time, going off of what Vertas said.
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Davairus
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 07, 2008 1:07 am    Post subject:

The point of saves is that they directly counteract spells. You dont seriously expect to be able to do something like, cast sanc, then wear a suit of aff to protect your sanc against anyone? You should choose saves to counter opponents.
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Shughurd



Joined: 21 May 2004
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Location: Estonia

PostPosted: Mon Jan 07, 2008 7:53 am    Post subject:

Mandor is so retarded, why do people even reply to him?


Spells are fine as they are, just some puremage classes could use some nukedamage boost. Right now an invoker is like a gimp warrior with nerfed hps and 1 hit per round. It gets locate, sanc and all the crap, but these really don't matter that much as any warrior/serker you fight will have 4-5x harder damage and you'll just get raped unless you get alot of surprise attacks and lucky uberstreams.
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Mandor



Joined: 03 Mar 2006
Posts: 794

PostPosted: Mon Jan 07, 2008 8:33 am    Post subject:

Shughurd wrote:
Mandor is so retarded, why do people even reply to him?


Spells are fine as they are, just some puremage classes could use some nukedamage boost. Right now an invoker is like a gimp warrior with nerfed hps and 1 hit per round. It gets locate, sanc and all the crap, but these really don't matter that much as any warrior/serker you fight will have 4-5x harder damage and you'll just get raped unless you get alot of surprise attacks and lucky uberstreams.


ironic.
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_Clifton_
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Joined: 08 Dec 2005
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Location: your and you're are not the same. they're, there, and their are not the same. learn to english.

PostPosted: Mon Jan 07, 2008 4:10 pm    Post subject:

Shughurd wrote:
Mandor is so retarded, why do people even reply to him?


QFT. He also brings back dead threats and posts inane bs.
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Davairus
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 08, 2008 12:23 am    Post subject:

Eh.. I reply because there is a responsibility upon me to pass knowledge down to the younger members of the playerbase. If nobody does that, we'll just end up with a pile of noobs being dominated by a couple sociopathic losers that master the game because they never stop playing mud and don't help anyone. Noobs are the future of AR, not those sort. It'll become a very dull mud when we start leaving them in a state of ignorance. We have to treat newbies very well. I wouldnt say Mandor is complete newbie but he is not quite as knowledgeable as he believes. With some help he could probably be the next Hrash, as long as he knows when and who to listen to. There are still alot of AR players that have it in them to be much better at this game than I, that just need a push to help them get started.

BTW I prefer to help people who help others in turn.
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Wholesale Johnson



Joined: 25 Jan 2007
Posts: 142

PostPosted: Sun Jan 20, 2008 5:42 am    Post subject:

Davairus wrote:
he could probably be the next Hrash


what could I be?
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_Clifton_
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Joined: 08 Dec 2005
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 20, 2008 7:27 am    Post subject:

Hannables.
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Shughurd



Joined: 21 May 2004
Posts: 128
Location: Estonia

PostPosted: Sun Jan 20, 2008 10:06 am    Post subject:

_Clifton_ wrote:
Hannables.


rofl, qft
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Mummy



Joined: 11 Sep 2006
Posts: 698
Location: Under Resatimm's Ass

PostPosted: Mon Jan 21, 2008 6:14 pm    Post subject:

_Clifton_ wrote:
Hannables.
Who?
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_Clifton_
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Joined: 08 Dec 2005
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Location: your and you're are not the same. they're, there, and their are not the same. learn to english.

PostPosted: Wed Jan 23, 2008 8:00 am    Post subject:

http://www.google.com/search?q=hannables+%22abandoned+realms%22&hl=en&client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&hs=Z8u&filter=0

Basically, calling anyone Hannables is biggest insult in AR. That guy turned out to be really cool too. He stopped hanging around in chat though, sucks.
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Shughurd



Joined: 21 May 2004
Posts: 128
Location: Estonia

PostPosted: Wed Jan 23, 2008 6:13 pm    Post subject:

It's good of how you are utterly useless against a person with your "class resists" on them. Before you could atleast dispel your enemy when your 101+ blind attempts didn't land, now all you can do with a human shaman is shit cherry pies and pound em with your hammer, with your supreme second attack and imaginary enhanced damage, oh and occasionally you can also hit them with a so uber harm spell, which you then have to wait for 15+ mins to recast. And not to mention that before you could even pound the warrior below few wounds, you would be kicked into the sky by his nice fourth attack, enhanced damage and dual wield. While still not being able to do anything else than cure crit, sanct, hex, word. That's how things are nowadays, you may had 10+ male break, person just puts on 4 pieces of male resists and they're immune to you. So much for "shaman spells".


GG.
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_Clifton_
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Location: your and you're are not the same. they're, there, and their are not the same. learn to english.

PostPosted: Wed Jan 23, 2008 6:58 pm    Post subject:

ahaha..

cause continual + cause serious is still ridiculously overpowered.
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Shughurd



Joined: 21 May 2004
Posts: 128
Location: Estonia

PostPosted: Thu Jan 24, 2008 12:42 pm    Post subject:

_Clifton_ wrote:
ahaha..

cause continual + cause serious is still ridiculously overpowered.


o rly? try to spam down a warrior with cause serious?
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Vandrez



Joined: 04 Nov 2005
Posts: 92
Location: SexyStilo

PostPosted: Thu May 22, 2008 3:39 pm    Post subject:

how about making Dark Knights better. Heh.....
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