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The event "Bad Blood - Gulgru vs Afales" is beginning in 8 days, 4 hours.

Necros and protection creature
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Burzuk
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Joined: 20 Jan 2004
Posts: 529

PostPosted: Thu Dec 14, 2006 10:56 pm    Post subject:

Xerties wrote:
If you want to give lowbie mages a little extra 'umph' at the low levels


Do we? Mages are supposed to have their oomph late, not early. Sounds like you're in favor of making mages easier early on, but we Imps may or may not be.

As I see it, everything we do to strengthen mages at early levels is a strong disincentive for us to strengthen mages at late levels. You can already see that we've made made the "revised" mage spells like acid blast and rend life to be heavily biased toward high-level use. If anything, the problem is with spellcasting are still issues like stupidly strong lightning bolts at level 13 (especially in the hands of DK's), which we do intend to address at some point.

Xerties wrote:
It seems to me at the moment that wands isn't a highly practiced thing because there isn't much use for them, aside from that cabal item.


We've learned from other muds where the opposite is true: mages who spend hours upon hours accumulating wands and other "preps" (both offensive and defensive) and wind up stacking them and burning them up all at once to utterly tear through their opponent. Quite frankly, I don't think fights should be decided by who's had more free time hiding from people and sitting on their ass stockpiling 10 different wands to use (this makes the game VERY unfriendly toward more casual players, and has been a frequent criticism of muds who do this sort of thing). That's why things will continue to be set up as casted spells >> magic tems, with magic items relegated to a more utility use.

Again, keep in mind that this is also a zero-sum game: every bit we add to wands is (by competition) taking away from actual casted spells. I for one would like to emphasize spellcasting over wand-hoarding/spamming. We already have plenty of magic item stockpiling with purples, cabal supplies, and soon mystic artifacts. We have no intention of skewing things any further in that direction to dig ourselves into the hole that those other muds have.

Xerties wrote:
1, help lowbie mages level


Lowbies mages should face an uphill battle. That's why we want to give them strong spells at high levels. Remember, we've already made them 0-exp classes to help them in this department.

Xerties wrote:
Like if you use an ice wand and a fire wand the temperature swing causes extra damage or something.


Xerties wrote:
Another idea with the wands/spells in general. Maybe there could be some sort of relationship akin to 'duet' where if person A uses icicle, person B uses flame arrow, then they combine somehow and do extra damage.


These two are essentially the same idea, with variations on the casting source (i.e. same vs different casters, wand vs casted spells, etc). All I'll say is for now is that it's already a feature in the afflictive module, but for spells, not wands, and with no restrictions on casting source (i.e. 3 casters coordinating spells will stack faster than one caster simply because they can cast 3 times as many spells). And yes, it's invoker-specific, so you don't get dks getting uber fireball/iceball combos.

Erlwith wrote:
Once ten souls have been collected a Necromancer may activate the stone to create a savebreak item of their choice (dependant on the original color they cast). The stone will only accept pinnacled souls that the necromancer himself has slain.


Necros can already conjure up sickles/scythes and souls. That's more than enough conjured items. Plus, we have a better use planned for souls down the road.

I'll also add:

a) good luck trying to practice soulstone up to 100%;
b) good luck trying to accumulate 10 level 50 souls without dying and/or being looted;
c) mind you that the only character remotely able to achieve this so far has been Mortumar -- do you really want to make someone like him even stronger? If you've been faring as well as someone like him has, you'll already accumulate enough equipment to make skills like this gratuitous and/or overkill.
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trance_monkey



Joined: 16 Nov 2005
Posts: 198

PostPosted: Thu Dec 14, 2006 11:28 pm    Post subject:

This might be moot if it's already being addressed in the afflictive module.

I see the point for making mages weaker at lower levels on purpose... soooo, instead of adding new firepower to them, what about more utility to make them more appealing as a group member?

Toxic flux can be said to be along those lines, but it's still a firepower spell. And at (or below) levels where Toxic Flux can initially be used, I wouldn't consider a necro for a group based on his or her firepower ability... I'd only take them if it's the only choice I had. Rend life isn't even very useful at those levels since the necro can't get enough damroll.

Now, it SHOULD be hard for a necro at earlier levels. I agree.

I'm just curious how feasible it would be for all mages to get some more utility spells for group situations to make them more appealing as groupmates?

It's shitty when OOC groups are the only way to rank a class. For vets, they might know how to rank a mage better than the average player (myself), and definately better than a brand new player. For us non-veterans, though, it can seem impossible.

EDIT:

I liked Davairus' idea of animating body parts to do damage. Instead of damage, what about extra blocking for the tank?

"The ogre's slash is blocked by the femur of a flying leg!"

"A rotting hand parries the nymph's attack!"

I donno, didn't really brainstorm it much. I can just see why there shouldn't be more firepower, and perhaps having an additional damage spells are most likely going to just be repackaging other skills. If I play another mage, I'd just like to be more attractive as a groupmate.

Maybe I should make a female mage...


Last edited by trance_monkey on Fri Dec 15, 2006 1:25 am; edited 1 time in total
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Xerties



Joined: 24 Feb 2006
Posts: 484

PostPosted: Fri Dec 15, 2006 12:47 am    Post subject:

Well I guess I'll keep setting them up, you'll keep knocking them down Smile
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Davairus
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Joined: 16 Jan 2004
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 15, 2006 9:49 am    Post subject:

The point I was hoping to make was that creativity often attacks the mainstream, unpopular stuff. Playing lowbie mages is a frustrating experience, in my opinion, not something I've cared enough about to bung ideas at, although I can see a new player's point of view.

Here's a lowbie spell.. suppose you have a "travel" spell, and what it does is casts directions to someplace. For example, if youre in Seringale.. cast 'travel' shire. ..and your spell walks you there. Is that worthless to high ranks? Kinda..but we're lazy about walking too, maybe not, depending if the max distance castable increases enough. I'd be willing to cast my way through several areas, definitely, and if I was tracking a mage, I'd be gunning for the points he stops at (simple balancing factor is to lag them when they reach the endpoint). To true newbies it'd be pure gold, not only does it reinforces the concept of making a mage to be able to ID stuff, but it saves having to spam teleport to find cool new places (I bet you remember doing that?). We want newbies exploring, do we not? Here's something that helps them to.

Like that idea or not, there's no question that it doesn't seem creative, and all I did was sit here, look at something I found at fault, and combine a few things we've already made. (I have made adventurers that walk short distances already, someone else came up with the concept of low level mage being useful for ID.)

Ranking is one of the most unpopular activities on the mud, so I find myself bunging lots of ideas its way. Crafting ingredient drops, quests that interact with them (e.g. goblin exterminator), more interesting encounters due to there being weapons present, etc. That's another territory I daydream a lot about.

I'm sure there's plenty other things we haven't given thought for, though we do have creative imps I admit.
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