Vinson NEWBIE chats: 'Naerhzhor,don't talk about connections or anything like that. Stay in character at all times.'
Naerhzhor NEWBIE chats: 'Argh sorry.'
An Immortal NEWBIE chats: 'Don't use newbie chat for this.'
Naerhzhor NEWBIE chats: 'That was my fault.'
Naerhzhor NEWBIE chats: 'Sorry.'
Conundo NEWBIE chats: 'What do you use?'
An Immortal NEWBIE chats: 'This is a channel for new players to ask questions and get help.'
Naerhzhor NEWBIE chats: 'I sometimes am not sure how to phrase things '
Naerhzhor NEWBIE chats: 'And am happy to be called on it...was my fault.'
Fygh NEWBIE chats: 'No worries, now you know.'
Thorgoth NEWBIE chats: 'Usually connections are referred to as "our minds", if that helps.'
An Immortal NEWBIE chats: 'When in doubt, use tells so that it doesn't encourage bad behavior in others.'
Naerhzhor NEWBIE chats: 'Thank yoiu.'
An Immortal NEWBIE chats: 'Especially for pinnacled characters.'
Conundo NEWBIE chats: 'Tells are suppose to be rp too I thought.'
An Immortal NEWBIE chats: 'They are.'
Vinson NEWBIE chats: 'I'm with Conundo on this.'
Conundo NEWBIE chats: 'I'd use newbie but if you say so your grace.'
An Immortal NEWBIE chats: 'Newbie chat is not for general ooc.'
Conundo NEWBIE chats: 'Well tells aren't for any OOC.'
Naerhzhor 0 , 0 , 0 . Is smite killed or just kind of like a slap from the gods that does damage? I really hope NOT killed. Conundo 0 , 0 , 0 . just a lightning bolt from the gods that does damage.
[reply to Conundo][reply to tayyah]
Vinson tried to explain the RP boundaries to obviously new Naerhzhor but the wizinvis Immortal had different perspective.
"Tells" have never been used to school people OOC.
An Immortal NEWBIE chats: 'When in doubt, use tells so that it doesn't encourage bad behavior in others.' - What was said prior to this was quite the opposite.
All in all, seems like a misunderstanding.
[reply to maeve]
I ask everyone to please be aware of what you say on the newbie chat. Because of the low playerbase, we don't get a lot of action to take it off the main page so it stays there for a while.
Matrix 
3 , 0 , 1 . tell is an in-character channel, full stop. The player in question did not know how to behave appropriately and needed instruction. The newbie channel is obviously the best place for instructing newbies on how to appropriately communicate. The newbie channel is the only out-of-character channel. Whether or not it shows up on the stream is completely irrelevant Vevier 
1 , 0 , 2 . It's not irrelevant. The stream is the first face we put forward to the rest of the internet. That shouldn't be full of people calling each other out for breaking character on a channel that's supposed to be a support system. Matrix 
3 , 0 , 0 . nobody was being "called out", someone was politely instructing a player on how to handle ooc communication in the most relevant channel Lorne 
3 , 1 , 0 . ....What? You got it the exact opposite Vevier. I 100% agree with Ranix on this, it's always been this way. Vevier 
0 , 2 , 0 . What is more likely to break immersion for people? Sending a private tell or spamming everyone in the game and our front page with the issue? Lorne 
1 , 1 , 0 . You're just going to keep doubling down even though you're wrong? Ok.
Lorne 
2 , 1 , 0 . The point isn't about breaking immersion, the chat is there for total newbies who need help. When a total newbie asks "hi guys, im new here, where do i go after i go up from the mud school?" It's pretty retarded imo to respond with some IC bullshit about reading SCROLLS or Aye, perhaps yea may traverse south of the squares till the fiery goblins may amast, yarr.
Vevier 
0 , 0 , 0 . That wasnt the case here. The characters in question were in the middle of end game content. Newbies need newbie chat for questions. Vets should not be using it to reprimand people. Ill double down on that all day. Matrix 
1 , 0 , 0 . again: nobody is being reprimanded and nobody is being called out. There's a new player at 50. That's just how easy it is to rank to 50 nowadays.
Naerhzhor 4 , 0 , 0 . I understand that Vevier is trying to maintain the integrity of the MUD. I just want to mention that I didn't feel belittled or anything about the comment. I have pretty good internet so this hasn't happened to me before and I just was struggling on how to make sure people knew that I was having issues. I have been treated pretty well by people, which keeps me coming back. I feel that I am always in character...I may just need a bit of guidance on situations like these where I was having DNS issues. Once I ran a repair I was able to reconnect. I wanted to make sure the group knew that I had been having problems to begin with. Vevier 
0 , 0 , 0 . Hi Naerhzhor, I'm glad you are having a good time here and I think generally you have been doing a great job staying IC. Thats one of the reasons I didnt want you to see yourself called out on the main page of the mud every time you came to the homepage.
Matrix 
1 , 0 , 0 . This seems like a bad idea. Newbie chat in stream communicates to players who visit the homepage that newbies are being helped and that help is available for them Naerhzhor 1 , 0 , 0 . Thank you! I will say as an addendum, I do learn things from the Newbie chat just reading from the portal on occasion. I am sure there is a balancing act to consider here of course.
[reply to Vevier]NEWBIE CHAT
Syntax: newbie <message>
Newbie chat is available for novices below rank 20, mentors, and everyone under
rank 10 to ask and answer questions about gameplay. You are allowed to speak
out of character on this channel, if you need technical questions answered.
Members of the <MYSTIC> coterie are purposely devoted to helping new adventurers,
so if you see any on (WHO), you can contact them via this channel to ask them
for more guidance. Experienced players may also have opted to act as MENTORS,
and are often available to answer questions as well.
Note that questions answered on newbie chat must be accompanied with a referral
to a helpfile. If this condition cannot be met, a bug should be filed so that
this can be rectified.
See also : HELP MENTOR
Vnum: [1016] NEWBIE CHAT
Total newbies won't be immersed yet, cuz they don't have a fucking clue what to do and vets knows its there to help. Someone looking at our webpage will understand what is going on, it's not like people aren't actively helping other people in the community. I doubt they'll think so lowly of it.
In another recent post you were pushing the idea that players who are "unprepared to fight" should be left alone by more powerful characters, such as a Warlord, or it is bad RP. That attitude leads directly to new players having 50s. Should experienced players help inexperienced players rank to 50 or should they beat them down and ensure they stay at lower levels? You can't have it both ways, you need to pick one
I do understand that the portal shows pk and newbie chat and if there was a bunch of general OOC banter rather than questions asked/answered it may put of people looking to immerse themselves in an Rp(pk) mud. I think everyone is coming from a point of "just wanting to make the mud a great place", which is appreciated in my eyes.
Ill look into getting newbie chat removed from stream, since we shouldn't be highlighting any ooc chatter at all.
[reply to Vevier]
It is my understanding that if I had worded it as a headache in my mind, that would've been better phrased and I will work to better my interactions.
Lorne 
2 , 1 , 0 . I don't think you did anything wrong on the newbie chat. I mean people say oh you should say "Aye, one moment, my mind wanders". Like I know you're fucking going AFK to get your kraft dinner out of the microwave or taking a whizz. It doesn't make the illusion stick if everyone just replaces the word connection with "mind wanders", we all know what it means. Matrix 
1 , 0 , 0 . Dickhead auctions, "WTS gambled torso with 2 layers of damage, 3 layers of... uh... accuracy, ten, um, health, and +2 str"
[reply to Naerhzhor]Vevier, it may not be that off-putting to have such chat on the stream since it shows players are eager to help new players maintain in-character conduct (in a polite fashion).
I will say that as an Imm I have had some occasions in the past (before stream existed) where I used tells to quietly teach newbies one-on-one who really didn't know how to do anything - couldn't pick up a sack, open doors, or even look at the room - so it wouldn't be disruptive to everybody else playing. This is might be the perspective Vevier is coming from. That said, Naerhzhor has progressed way farther from this stage and already learned what to do at this point from everyone's comments and suggestions.
Thanks all for the input, no need to make it a bigger issue than it is.
[reply to Vanisse]
Looking forward to more interactions.
Naerhzhor 0 , 0 , 0 . Thank you! I have had great interactions with you and appreciate your subtle guidance.
[reply to Xalnoch]If I'm reading this log correctly, I think the main issue is that the ooc content is not in response to a newbie question, but rather an unprompted comment from an established player. If that's the case, then I agree that the established player should attempt to convey that thought via proper rp channels and not resort to the lazy option of ooc newbie chat.
So basically two scenarios. (1) newbie asks ooc question, I think merits an appropriate response even if the response is ooc.
(2) established player wishes to convey information to a newbie unprompted by the newbie channel, I think that needs to be via roleplay.
[reply to Ergorion]