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Kazagistar
Joined: 06 Mar 2006
Posts: 61
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 Posted: Thu May 11, 2006 4:24 am Post subject: Justice thief? |
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Not sure where this should go, so I decided to put it here.
It relates to the following experience I had:
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<143hp 164m 134mv>
Ibyc says 'I have a sword for you.'
<143hp 164m 134mv>
Ibyc says 'If you can lift it.'
<143hp 164m 134mv>
Nakachi looks at Ibyc.
<143hp 164m 134mv> say Well?
You say 'Well?'
<143hp 164m 144mv>
A dwarven city guard walks south.
<143hp 164m 144mv>
Nakachi looks at you.
<143hp 164m 144mv>
Nadek walks down.
Nakar the storm giant mercenary walks down.
<143hp 164m 144mv>
Ibyc drops an elite flamberge.
<143hp 164m 144mv>
Nakachi gets an elite flamberge.
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Then I confronted him later. (condensed to speech)
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You say 'So nakachi, you often take things intended for other people?'
Nakachi says 'Hmm.'
Nakachi says 'He shouldnt have dropped it.'
Nakachi says 'Anything on ground is free for the taking.'
You say 'Is that in the code of justice, hmm?'
Nakachi says 'You wish to challenge your knowledge of the law with mine?'
Nakachi says 'Justices have their own motives.'
You say 'No, I simply ask you to... clarify.'
Nakachi says 'It would be different if I had looted it from a corpse.'
Nakachi says 'It was simply my motive to take the sword.'
Nakachi says 'That was 'dropped''
Nakachi says 'If you didn't notice.'
You say 'As you knew it was for me.'
Nakachi says 'Too bad.'
Nakachi says 'Now go away.'
Nakachi says 'You bother me.'
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I guess this kind of bothered me. If it was any old player, or even just a lawful, I wouldn't care. But that it was a Justice cabal member, that kind of bugs me. Is what he said true, or is what he did a bit injust? (Especialy since Ibyc is almost cetainly a newbie). |
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Baer
 
Joined: 22 Jan 2004
Posts: 618
Location: Michigan
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| Posted: Thu May 11, 2006 4:37 am Post subject: |
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Anything dropped on the ground is considered litter, and thus, free for the taking.
Most justices just sacrifice things that are dropped, be grateful. |
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Kazagistar
Joined: 06 Mar 2006
Posts: 61
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| Posted: Thu May 11, 2006 4:53 am Post subject: |
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Yeah, I guess. It just seemed wrong because
1) Ibyc is almost certainly new to this game, and probably does not know how to GIVE people things (I saw him and his pet practicing emotes).      
2) He knew it was intended to be given to someone else. If someone says "here, take this" and places something on the ground, is it fair if the guy who happened to be nearby quickly snaches it up?
3) The policy GROUND == LITTER is does not make sense if the above is true, and it is also illogical if you "consider it litter" and therefore grab an KEEP it. |
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rakham
Joined: 30 Apr 2006
Posts: 15
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| Posted: Thu May 11, 2006 6:01 am Post subject: |
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im not sure how it works around here, but my opinion is that this is along the lines of character assassination.
this is an IC matter that should be dealt with IC. bring it up to his superiors. if they tell you 'oh well, theres no law against it.', then bring it to the forums, but leave the names out. that just invites a flame fest.
ask for new laws, or at least clarification of the laws....something like this:
HELP LAW, HELP LAWS
1. Murder, or attempted murder, is against the law. This includes any aggresive attacks upon another person.
2. Theft, or attempted theft. This includes looting corpses, taking something that doesnt belong to you, or plain theft. (hard to enforce, but at least the law is there)
3. Assisting a criminal. this includes protective spells, opening/closing doors to facilitate a criminals escape, healing or attacking a justice who is striking a criminal.
thats just off the top of my head. if the imms want things to be the way they are, then theres nothing you can do about it, except deal with it and move on. |
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Lorne
Immortal
Joined: 20 Jan 2004
Posts: 456
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| Posted: Thu May 11, 2006 6:21 am Post subject: |
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Law 2 - Theft and destruction of property within Seringale
Attempted theft, and/or destruction of another citizen's personal property is a
serious offense that bears the penalty of a WANTED flag. Some examples of acts
which violate this law: taking or sacrificing any involuntarily dropped items,
defiling or looting corpses, and of course prying and stealing. Anything you do
that causes another to lose equipment or their corpse is punishable by the law.
Note that items returning to the pits are also eligible for protection by
Law, but you must first inform an officer that you require this service. |
That is the second Seringale Law. As it says, taking or sacrificing any INVOLUNTARILY dropped items is agaisnt the Law. Although Nakachi could have knew that the blade was to be handed to someone else and took it, he has not directly violated any written Laws. You can argue that this is undesirable behavior for a Justice, but that's just opinions. I play by the book. |
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Sethronu
Immortal
Joined: 06 Jan 2006
Posts: 127
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| Posted: Thu May 11, 2006 6:28 am Post subject: |
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| disarm doesnt drop to floor now so when else would that apply |
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Lorne
Immortal
Joined: 20 Jan 2004
Posts: 456
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| Posted: Thu May 11, 2006 6:59 am Post subject: |
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Demonic visage use to be able to drop weapons when disarm was changed, but that has now been changed too.
It could be outdated, as these things take awhile to update but that doesn't change the fact Nakachi has not violated anything. |
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marsd
Joined: 16 Jan 2004
Posts: 832
Location: Magewares
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| Posted: Thu May 11, 2006 12:23 pm Post subject: |
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| Involuntarily dropped doesn't apply to "drop item". Dropped items are free from masters, since it's discarded. |
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Vhrael
Immortal
Joined: 06 Jan 2006
Posts: 1085
Location: Texas
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| Posted: Thu May 11, 2006 1:12 pm Post subject: |
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| Sethronu wrote: |
| disarm doesnt drop to floor now so when else would that apply |
Pilfer still knocks stuff out of your inventory... that's probably one of the few remaining examples of "involuntarily dropped" I can think of. |
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Davor
Joined: 16 Jan 2004
Posts: 229
Location: Seeogra
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| Posted: Thu May 11, 2006 2:46 pm Post subject: |
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Bull.
Nakachi didn't break any code, law... even remotely.
The quoted Seringale law was primarily instituted to wrestle the issue of duels. The usual scenario was duel outside arena, someone loosing half of their arsenal due to disarm&scavengers... issue of sneak "looting" of corpses and picking items of the ground was later addressed with known results...
We all know when was last duel played within the streets of seringale, heck even when was the last Arena duel... With these things out of the way, law is there to cover the pilfer (nevermind the fact that the last thief i saw using that skill to any degree was Camothakar) and possibly cover secondary looting (would not know if that applies ie. goody full loots the corpse in front of the justice. Evil items fall out of his hands, some evil in the same room picks them up off the ground... possible application of this law... shrug)
So stop angling for cheezy busts and play the game... as if there is not chronical lack of justices as it is... |
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Nakachi
Joined: 08 May 2006
Posts: 221
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| Posted: Thu May 11, 2006 5:08 pm Post subject: |
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Just to clarify, between the time that he dropped that sword and I picked it up, there was a good 2 minutes real life time... so obviously nothing happened in two minutes according to what he posted
Besides, you probably wouldn't have been able to wear that sword, and would probably have died and got looted, or have been pked and gotten looted before you could ever wear it
Dont take things too personal, and make sure you let him know that he can 'give' it to you... i dont know if you were afk or not, but if you were that still isnt my fault |
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crazyhorse
Joined: 19 Oct 2005
Posts: 627
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| Posted: Thu May 11, 2006 8:55 pm Post subject: |
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| Nakachi wrote: |
Besides, you probably wouldn't have been able to wear that sword, and would probably have died and got looted, or have been pked and gotten looted before you could ever wear it |
Yes...because THAT makes sense. Next time I see you, you can just hand over all your eq. Cuz your prolly gonna die anyway, So...why have it? That is the most ridiculous arguement I have ever heard. |
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Nakachi
Joined: 08 May 2006
Posts: 221
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| Posted: Thu May 11, 2006 9:05 pm Post subject: |
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| who cares, it got dropped, i waited a while until i picked it up... end of story |
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Erlwith
Joined: 22 Mar 2006
Posts: 1626
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| Posted: Thu May 11, 2006 9:19 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: |
| Yes...because THAT makes sense. Next time I see you, you can just hand over all your eq. Cuz your prolly gonna die anyway, So...why have it? That is the most ridiculous arguement I have ever heard. |
I've always assumed this to be the prime reason why when you lose items due to bugs or glitches you're not reimbursed. Items come and go, and dying happens so get over it and get something new.
Either that, or the staff don't give a shit. I'd like to think better of them. |
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crazyhorse
Joined: 19 Oct 2005
Posts: 627
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| Posted: Fri May 12, 2006 1:18 am Post subject: |
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I was merely pointing out the ridiculousness and the idiocy of his comment. Nothing to do with the subject matter, or EQ for that matter.
And now I feel like my post, and this one, is entirely useless. Hahaha. Bye! |
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Kalist19
Emissary
Joined: 19 Jan 2004
Posts: 1154
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| Posted: Fri May 12, 2006 11:36 pm Post subject: |
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| Be careful Nakachi. High ranking justices in the past have been uninducted or even denied for 'looking' corrupt. 'skirting' the law and 'looking bad' are surefire ways to get in trouble with the immortals. Best to just play the role. |
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Jamus
Joined: 18 Jun 2005
Posts: 577
Location: Valour
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| Posted: Sat May 13, 2006 3:43 am Post subject: |
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| Nakachi is just a prick for doing it, but he shouldn't get in any trouble for it. |
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Nakachi
Joined: 08 May 2006
Posts: 221
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| Posted: Sat May 13, 2006 6:54 pm Post subject: |
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| Wow... I love how that one action got me so much attention... what else can I do? |
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Kazagistar
Joined: 06 Mar 2006
Posts: 61
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| Posted: Sat May 13, 2006 8:09 pm Post subject: |
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I appoligize for using names; causing trouble was not my intention, and that is why I put this post in Newbie Q/A.
| Nakachi wrote: |
| Dont take things too personal, and make sure you let him know that he can 'give' it to you |
Of course not, I would not dream of taking anything personaly (although I cannot speak for my character  ), and I did tell him right after you grabbed it and ran.
| Nakachi wrote: |
| Just to clarify, between the time that he dropped that sword and I picked it up, there was a good 2 minutes real life time |
Because I have no wish to draw any more attention to you, I will not make any comment about how this is a lie. |
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Nakachi
Joined: 08 May 2006
Posts: 221
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| Posted: Sat May 13, 2006 8:37 pm Post subject: |
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| How would you know...? The incident occurred 2 days ago... So you're telling me you can prove that it was less than 2 minutes? This is pointless, I'm going to stop posting on this... this is ridiculous... DROP IT! |
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