Entrapment

[Sebryn]

Number 1:

[Kablamo]

Gestapo? The Nazi secrect police that killed jews? wtf

[Sebryn]

Don't tell me you actually expected fellow AR players to consider the emotional effect of their metaphors on others.

Well, I guess since it wasn't a poll started by divsky you might've thought that. Sadly, however, it isn't always the case. Hardly ever the case, actually.

[Rezakhan]

I highly dislike the change, as someone who plays mostly warrior-type classes. This just means anytime you want to chase someone you are fighting into town, visible or not, you have to use a detect item to see if a Justice is around.
Not to mention its yet another disadvantage for those poor Warlord wannabes, who know not only have to chase someone into town that may go invisible at any time, but have to worry there may be a Justice sitting there invisible as well.
The main reason I am against it is because of my conception of Justice as a group that would seek to prevent crime, rather than allow it, then punish the offenders. Allowing Justices to go invisible places more of an emphasis on punishment rather than prevention, while having Justices always be visible means they would exist at all times as a deterrent, which in my mind is what a Justice should be--someone who would more than anything else wish to see the laws respected.

[Mr Carbohydrate]

A very good point (about being a vissible deterent). And as for me mentioning the gestapo, sorry if I've offended anyone...I'll try to be more PC in future. Seems the invisible flagging thing is pretty unpopular though...perhaps it could be changed back?

[aicrules]

[Mr Carbohydrate]

This is not like the debate about speed traps, for the simple reason that this is a game. There seems to be some general confusion over the difference between laws and rules in AR. The laws are only present to make the game more fun, and have no value outside of that function. I think it was more fun before the new changes, when it was (SHOCK HORROR!) easier to break laws and get away with it. Sorry to repeat myself, but some people seem to missunderstand the argument.

[Enskel]

[aicrules]

[aicrules]

[Mr Carbohydrate]

Quote : "and like in real life you have to find the best way to ensure that people will follow the laws of the land whether you're there or not, there is no reason not to allow them to be invisible. "

The imms do no not WANT our chacters to follow the laws all the time (Aside from lawful chacters, of course) . The laws are a gameplay mechanic, following them is not in everyone's best interests, they are there to be broken where appropriate. How difficult it is to get away with breaking them is also merely a gameplay mechanic, and how difficult it SHOULD be to get away with breaking them is a matter of opinion. If the imms didn't want's us to break the law they would just make all the hometowns no attack areas.
It is just another struggle in the game: Just as knights battle legion, justice battles criminals, and there are simmilar balance issues.

[Altheripper]

[Gygh]

[Brains]

The problem is with handing out the flag BEFORE any proof was found.

The flag is, in practical terms, AR's equivalent of execution, prison time, fines, etc., all rolled into one ball of wax. How the players react to something like this is similar to how real-life citizens take similar news: we know it happens on rare occasion, but we don't like it and would rather it never happened in the first place.

[Altheripper]

It would also kinda depend on your rep with the justice. If you been busted by him multiple times before hes probably gonna flag you if he sees something suspicious before asking any questions.

[Hoarding Healer]

Although I hate that they can invis and flag, I guess you can think of it as cops and ghostcars. But the fact that they are pussies and always invised is just being total pussies, especially when they are the uber cabal too. Its like how much leverage do they need?

[Vertas]

Don't be an idiot its your fault for not keeping detects up. If there is a chance you might be attacked keep detects up, if you're pking keep detects up they can just quaff an anti cyclopse elixir and be gone. You wanna know real entrapment? Ensnare just get them past one of the gates, close the door, ensnare and bam keep the door closed and they're gone.

[Green Elephant]

[cleaning_ninja]

This is all really a moot point. Even if a justice cannot flag you while he/she is invis, the justice could still just go vis to flag you. I do not have any problem with justices being able to flag you while invis, because there is always a way around a rule... Law is an inevitable part of any society, and must be Held above any other ideal, without law there is chaos. According to Locke's social contract, when you are born into a society you are expected to uphold the laws. While this is not possible for chaotic beings, justices are lawful, and must strive to make law absolute. If this requires that they rule by fear, even when they are not around then so be it. Also, chaotic beings do not care whether justices are about or not, because they do not recognize law. So whether the justice is invis or not, a chaotic being will break the law.

[cleaning_ninja]

This is all really a moot point. Even if a justice cannot flag you while he/she is invis, the justice could still just go vis to flag you. I do not have any problem with justices being able to flag you while invis, because there is always a way around a rule... Law is an inevitable part of any society, and must be Held above any other ideal, without law there is chaos. According to Locke's social contract, when you are born into a society you are expected to uphold the laws. While this is not possible for chaotic beings, justices are lawful, and must strive to make law absolute. If this requires that they rule by fear, even when they are not around then so be it. Also, chaotic beings do not care whether justices are about or not, because they do not recognize law. So whether the justice is invis or not, a chaotic being will break the law.