Justice Guards

[Lorne]

Alright, I think Justices shouldn't be allowed to call their guards when there are no criminals present in the realms.

One, being the guards are an added protection for people who want to attack, that's like trying to attack a legion with his shadow by him 24/7.
Two, the guards can see invisibility/camo/hidden, so they can use the guard to tell where thieves, ninjas and rangers are which is an unfair advantage.

Now, you say the Justice could be using the guard for other purposes like overlooking a pit, or a criminal just died or left. Usually that's the case, but there have been some incidents where certain justices just pull guards out of nowhere for no apparent reason, except for the 2 reasons I stated above.

[Resatimm]

Justices arent supposed to have special guards out unless fufilling a justice duty.

IE criminals, equipment returning to the pit, duels, etc.

Remember, though, that sometimes you dont know what the Justice is up to. Might be one of the above situations that you missed.

[Burzuk]

[Clifton]

Wow... having a pet that dirt, disarms, and shield disarms plus takes leet damage that can rescue... still in discussion... interesting

[Louis]

wrong. justices are allowed to call their guards any time even if they are just town watching and not performing a specific function. certain immortals seem to be debating whether to allow it or not. a certain reason why a justice may want to keep a special guard around is so that it is right by their side when a crime happens, and to discourage someone from attacking a justice straight up in town. the first reason though is probably a better reason, though the second is also a good one because the attacker gets first attack on an unsuspecting justice. it should not be used to check where a thief is hidden, in my opinion. you'll notice, a stone merc, although it can detect hidden to yell if attacked, cannot be ordered to look at people. justices are also allowed to call their guard to defend themselves against any attack out of town, though they can't chase someone with the guard. if this is allowed, then there is nothing wrong with justices traveling around with a guard at their side. however, i have always wondered about being able to call a guard to defend yourself and where it becomes breaking the guideline of using a guard. however, i have never seen a justice really use the benefit of using a guard in defense, so its not really an issue right now.

having a guard by your side and not having to call it gives the opportunity for a justice to take out the attacker before his victim dies in town, because most of the time a split second is all you have to save them.

[Sebryn]

Oh, right Louis... like you know anything about playing a Justice...

[Burzuk]

[Sebryn]

[Phostan]

Yeah, Justices using their special guards to poke your thief because they know you're robbing from them and just want to keep tabs on your location is annoying. Being a Justice doesn't give them a right to know where I am unless I'm a criminal, which rarely happens if you're a halfing thief with high luck robbing them. I'd rather see a special guard not assist a Justice until the person fighting the Justice is flagged a criminal. I mean, if I attack them in town, I'm going to become a criminal, but unless they're real confident and flag me while fighting, they'll probably just flee to do it. So during the period where they're trying to run away far enough to flag me, the guard shouldn't assist. And I don't they should be able to summon special guards out of protected areas either. Look at it this way, if you're a Justice, and you're out on vacation in Solace, and someone jumps you, how is the city officials of Solace gonna feel about you taking down criminals in their town without their consent? It's basically being a vigilante, it's not your jurisdiction. Which is why I say give Justices a budget, like real police forces do. Gee guys, our budget for this year is only 8 million, no using justice shields unless you're getting killed by more then 2 people, and no using special guards unless you're up shit creek without a paddle, because when those special guards die, they're hard to replace, it takes months of training to train one special guard! Months! And we're gonna have to turn down the heating at HQ, because the heating bill is gonna cost us a fortune alone. Oh, and only plain cake donuts, or glazed, we don't have enough of a budget for the chocolate covered or cream filled kind. And water down your coffee!

[Louis]

would you also have warlords use forms only in duels and not on mobs, knights use stallions only when fighting legions but never on neutrals, and keep heralds from putting up their roar of words spell except while writing a book?

the justice isn't using his special guard while being the aggressor on you, and when he has his guard he can't even attack you. that means you can attack him, he can't attack you. if you're sanc'd and he isn't, go ahead and bash or hellstream, what's that guard gonna do when you smash his face in while the poor guy forgot to put up flight?

guards shouldn't be abused and they aren't. if you are going to fight a justice out of town, he is basically a non-caballed character because he has no cabal skills to counter yours (assuming you're in a cabal). if you are going to get flagged, what's the difference if you attack a justice with a guard or if the justice flees to call his guard?

and about going in to lag an unsuspecting justice to death while he is there with his guard.. i'm talking about that from experience. it was a nice, fuzzy feeling.

[Clifton]

Yeah, Louis, you said it. "he is basically a non-caballed character because he has no cabal skills to counter yours". And why should he have cabal powers when he is out of jurisdiction. To do a real life analogy, I view special guards as SWAT. When there is a life and death situation with hostages involved, you call in SWAT. You don't call in SWAT for the sake of having them there, and why should you?... So why have it in AR? Having a special guard follow and trail you when there isn't a need? It doesn't make sense. Getting threatened, running, and then calling for reinforcements makes more sense than having people trail you. Just my .02....

As for other cabals, their powers are used in their purpose. Warlords, for example, to make up the hinderance of using magic, have evolved precise combat tactics and skills (only makes sense doesn't it, adapt or be murdered), Knights crusade out in the open, high and mighty, on stallions, to accomplish their goals (guilt by association for neutrals). Heralds we don't need to talk about because they are essentially "un-caballed 50". And Legion, use all measures necessary.

[Enskel]

[Resatimm]

Ya but keep in mind that one can never know all the legions. If we meant for people to know who is legion, there would be a [LEGION] tag next to their name.

Res

[Clifton]

[Eldorian]

Justices typically use their special guards to temporarily hold the equipment of someone who just died in a duel. That's a situation where there may not be a criminal around, but a Justice would still want to call a special guard.

[Sebryn]

In a situation like that, Eldorian, would there be a way to add some kind of flag to the special guards that toggles the 'autoassist' for the guards when there isn't a criminal in town?

I don't even know if that's possible, but it might be a way to curb the problems people have with the special guards. They can hang around and carry equipment, etc., but they won't be actively assisting in a battle until someone shows up with the [WANTED] flag. Since the guards can already see hidden/invis characters, it won't put the Justices at a severe disadvantage, but it will remove all of the cries of "injustice" (yes, every pun intended) with regard to how special guards are abused.

Any thoughts?

[Eldorian]

I'm not sure I follow what you mean. A guard's autoassist would only matter if the Justice was attacked, right? And if a Justice were attacked in town, that means he's got a criminal on his hands, right?

I was addressing the question of whether or not to have it hardcoded so that Justices can't call a special guard unless there were a criminal on. A duel is one instance where they might want a special guard around even in the absence of criminals.