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The event "Bad Blood - Gulgru vs Afales" is beginning in 6 days, 6 hours.

Paladin's stake skill
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Faelon
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Joined: 23 Feb 2006
Posts: 938
Location: Your moms house.

PostPosted: Sat Mar 13, 2010 4:37 pm    Post subject:

Now I am confused, I had it in my head that wisdom helped shield block.
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Slade
Emissary


Joined: 17 Mar 2004
Posts: 666

PostPosted: Sat Mar 13, 2010 7:13 pm    Post subject:

Parry: Str/Wis
Dodge: Dex/Int
Shield Block: Con/Wis
Set Parry: 2h. switched over to dex I thought
Counterbalance: 1h
Riposte: 2h, overbear, type adv, reflex
Blur: Int
(Un)Holy Armor: Weight
Protection: Cross Align
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crazyhorse



Joined: 19 Oct 2005
Posts: 627

PostPosted: Sun Mar 14, 2010 1:37 am    Post subject:

The hell do you read THAT helpfile, and where can I get it? I really dont like how information like that is so hard to obtain.
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Master



Joined: 07 May 2009
Posts: 94

PostPosted: Sun Mar 14, 2010 1:56 am    Post subject:

The only time I've seen the stats for Parry, Dodge, or Shield Block is in the Combat section of the website.
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Mandor



Joined: 03 Mar 2006
Posts: 794

PostPosted: Mon Mar 15, 2010 5:48 am    Post subject:

Slade wrote:
Parry: Str/int
Dodge: Dex
Shield Block: Con/Wis
Set Parry: 2h. static and not based on a stat.


fixed it for you.

thats why set parry is better on a low strength race, it gets no negatives.
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Mandor



Joined: 03 Mar 2006
Posts: 794

PostPosted: Mon Mar 15, 2010 5:54 am    Post subject:

Slade wrote:

Mandor wrote:

and even fleeing immediately, I still dont get out of the lag before the warrior comes in..

You have time to flee, take a leg collapse or dirt stumble or whatever, and still get away before it is possible for them to attack you. You have to do it very early, and in the case of dirt you have to be able to run blind otherwise if they murder you, you have added to the duration of the skill by flee and still ended up pinned.



even at its earliest, a high dex race gets face planted too long, no matter what weapons they hold.

Quote:
A vicious skill, hobble allows one to attempt to temporarily cripple
one's opponent with a weapon attack. If successful, a hobbled opponent
loses dexterity and cannot dodge at all. The dexterity loss is more
catastrophic to more dextrous targets than to naturally clumsy targets. In
addition, fleeing on hobbled legs will often result in the victim falling
over from the pain and effort, allowing the pursuer to catch up. Higher
strength increases one's chance of successfully hobbling one's opponent, as
does exploiting one's combat style advantages while making the attempt.


bold and underlined the part that says how bad it is. hella reduction in dex leads to low hitroll on a race with low str that cant overcome parry as well via str advantage means relying on hitroll, which gets nuked. then the faceplanting is a lag time long enough that it allows a flee to become a murder every time.

since hobble lowers damage output by nuking hitroll, how will you outdamage them when they dual wield and bash? flee would be the option, to heal some and get some spacing, but when flee results in a faceplant every single time, with a lag that allows them to just remurder you, especially because they see which way you walk because your autosneak gets nuked (low str, low hp, and autosneak means you need to make first strikes, flee, and make first strikes again, this is nuked by hobble planting you in either way you use the word plant), how does an elf paladin draw out a fight then, when bash removes spells, and hobble keeps you from fleeing? its just a lock.


Davairus wrote:
Wis helps parry defenses, so elves would be a bit behind, drows would be a lot behind, this is just parry though. Int helping dodge makes those guys very good at it.


well thats new.

but yes, basically its saying that the two biggest stats the elf races have is the two stats that dont work at all for hybrids in defensive terms, meaning they rely on the two worst stats they have for defenses, meaning they have the worst defenses in the game, and cannot afford to not flee -> murder, particularly when autosneak is one of the reasons for their 500 exp hole, because that makes it so much more effective.


Last edited by Mandor on Mon Mar 15, 2010 6:04 am; edited 1 time in total
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Ergorion



Joined: 16 Mar 2007
Posts: 2156

PostPosted: Mon Mar 15, 2010 6:02 am    Post subject:

Mandor wrote:
elf paladin


There's your problem right there...
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Mandor



Joined: 03 Mar 2006
Posts: 794

PostPosted: Mon Mar 15, 2010 6:05 am    Post subject:

Ergorion wrote:
Mandor wrote:
elf paladin


There's your problem right there...


yeah, I know, which is the point.
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crazyhorse



Joined: 19 Oct 2005
Posts: 627

PostPosted: Mon Mar 15, 2010 6:34 pm    Post subject:

Mandor, if you get hobbled and immediately flee, you will get away every time.
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Mandor



Joined: 03 Mar 2006
Posts: 794

PostPosted: Tue Mar 16, 2010 4:27 am    Post subject:

in my experience, nope.
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Olyn
Immortal


Joined: 23 Jul 2008
Posts: 3249
Location: Pennsylvania

PostPosted: Tue Mar 16, 2010 12:12 pm    Post subject:

crazyhorse wrote:
Mandor, if you get hobbled and immediately flee, you will get away every time.


I've found this true as well. Hobble lag is slightly more than hobbled flee lag. You have to flee before any rounds of battle for it to work.
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crazyhorse



Joined: 19 Oct 2005
Posts: 627

PostPosted: Tue Mar 16, 2010 2:13 pm    Post subject:

Your experience is stupid.

Lol, I keed I keed, I joke I joke.

This is the case. Period. Same with dirt kick flee lag. Hobble isnt there to be a kill all end all.

I "KNOW" that this is the case. Your experience is flawed in some way.
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Faelon
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Joined: 23 Feb 2006
Posts: 938
Location: Your moms house.

PostPosted: Tue Mar 16, 2010 3:15 pm    Post subject:

Have to agree with my brother here. Don't know why you have been gimped by it, but you aren't fleeing fast enough. Do you spam commands? Lag yourself out before they hobble? Best time to hobble is right after they lag themselves for a round and a half, so they can't flee out RIGHT after, because they will get away, stumble or not.
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Davairus
Implementor


Joined: 16 Jan 2004
Posts: 10351
Location: 0x0000

PostPosted: Tue Mar 16, 2010 10:23 pm    Post subject:

Meh.. you guys are dumb sometimes. I would post the code for parry if I thought you would bother reading it.

Lets review parry.

1. weapon types

These fall into offensive and defensive categories, and mainhand and offhand. A whip would be greatly difficult for your victim to parry, but would be pretty difficult for you to parry with. A dagger would be more effective in the off-hand, for both offense and defense. The weapon you choose determines the pace of the fight. Its important to take this into account when you meet a different class.

There is a table posted somewhere.

2. weapon advantages

This is simple - blade/shaft/segment, like rock paper scissors, with weapon ward to prevent the whole thing from troubling you. This means a mage with a mace and a weapon ward is doing good on parry.

3. foreign weapon types

This is your penalty for not learning a weapon. If you can't learn dagger at your trainer, then people with daggers effectively get a weapon advantage worth of offense for attacking you with one. This stacks with #2. If I recall right, its also blocked by weapon wards, making it very important to keep this up all the time vs warriors, and also very useful to do so. That would have to be tested out by you guys, since I can't recall offhand and don't intend to look into it, so have fun.

4. strength

The strength works both ways. A higher strength means being able to parry better and being effective against the parry defense, in the same way as hitroll. High strength fighters are therefore a clear problem for mages.

5. hitroll

Hitroll lowers the enemy chance of parrying your attacks.

6. Wisdom

This boosts your own parry only. While this is obviously not as effective as strength, you might want to keep in mind that a gnome has a 25 wis, making his parry pretty super.

examples:
Gnome mages are the best "tank" of the mages, because of this. Lots of hp and a big parry. An elf ranger may not have lots of hp, but he would have good avoidance because of his big int/wis, and a lot of other benefits from 24 dex. A halfling ranger doesn't really look as good vs physical damage but has the resist. The half-elf stats lend themselves well to tanking but offensively they suck. Keep that in mind.
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Mandor



Joined: 03 Mar 2006
Posts: 794

PostPosted: Wed Mar 17, 2010 11:39 am    Post subject:

23 dex, dav. 24 is drows.
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