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what would you prefer for generating consumables? |
laboratory in lair that manufactures stuff |
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15% |
[ 2 ] |
sending mercenaries/pets on missions to fetch them |
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38% |
[ 5 ] |
more manual farming |
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46% |
[ 6 ] |
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Total Votes : 13 |
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Davairus Implementor
Joined: 16 Jan 2004 Posts: 10358 Location: 0x0000
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Posted: Fri Apr 09, 2021 8:35 am Post subject: Consumable gathering options |
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Here are some additional options i was thinking about for generating consumables/materials.
(A) A laboratory you can setup in your lair that will just make random potions (similar to planting of seeds). --skips gathering ingredients completely
(B) A new command "missions" that sends teams of pets away to return with a consumable item. send for gold, purple potions, gyvels, ore, shards, wood for lair items, anything you like but you can't use that pet at the same time as it is out on mission. imagination is the limit here. -- gathering ingredients only
(C) more manual activity opportunities e.g. adding ore veins to areas with mines.
Obviously these are very different directions. Please use the poll or write something else below. BTW, this probably will not make it into the next patch due to time constraint. |
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Kalist19 Emissary
Joined: 19 Jan 2004 Posts: 1154
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Posted: Fri Apr 09, 2021 1:29 pm Post subject: |
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Oh B sounds a lot like the wow missions thing - I remember the first expansion they released that in. That was such an awesome mechanic! It was so awesome to keep track of when they would be coming back so you could log in, collect reward, and send them off again. Lots of dopamine there. That would be super cool to see in AR and it would help everyone really (ie clerics could still use it for gold or shards or whatever). Cool idea!
At the same time it feels a bit silly to imagine everyone having 20 purps and 20 gyvels at all times since doing the prep work is one thing that separates the stage 4+ from stage 3. |
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Vanisse Immortal
Joined: 06 Jan 2006 Posts: 2793 Location: inside a tree
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Posted: Fri Apr 09, 2021 2:08 pm Post subject: |
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B) You'd probably want to limit the consumable types in some way. Otherwise, given the types of consumables we have out there you will end up with people having not just 20 purples and gyvels but also cure potions and fly potions and armor potions and curse and fireball scrolls and basically no need for clerics ever again. |
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Ashlyn
Joined: 20 Oct 2006 Posts: 291
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Posted: Fri Apr 09, 2021 4:34 pm Post subject: |
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B if anything. Im personally against making consumables easier to get. The game is designed in a way that the classes should be balanced. Consumables give you an edge against the classes that get the spells as part of their kit. I had my own struggles with consumables and was told to learn to manage consumables better or play a class that gets the spells. Tough love, but ive gotten better for it. Want easier consumables? Roleplay halfway decently and stick within the confines of a cabal. Don't be a total douchebag and alienate everyone who can help you, make friends with a shaman, illusionist, healer, invoker, etc. |
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Kalist19 Emissary
Joined: 19 Jan 2004 Posts: 1154
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Posted: Fri Apr 09, 2021 5:28 pm Post subject: |
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I kind of like Ashlyn's post better than mine..
As a big bad evil I (but a bit lazy) in the past, I have definitely made others/underlings collect supplies for me. "I will expect you to give me purples/gyvels/etc whenver I require them. You had best keep a supply in hand". And as she said, if you make friends, they are prob willing to share/help you collect. If you either aren't strong enough to force others to help you, or your RP prevents you from making friends, well...that's not a game-thing, that's a you-thing...
I've definitely gone into fights with a handfull of purples and a couple of gyvels (way too lazy on any char to use anything else like healing/armor/bless/etc) and have still won. All that other stuff is like an 'optional small edge' people can go 'above and beyond' to attain.
It's pretty easy to do hobgoblin/gyvel rotation. If the zombies were weaker, you could add them into the rotation too and basically get 4 purps/1 gyvel at a go. It's a bit tougher when you are caballed and fighting constantly, but it's still possible to squeeze in. |
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Davairus Implementor
Joined: 16 Jan 2004 Posts: 10358 Location: 0x0000
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Posted: Fri Apr 09, 2021 5:37 pm Post subject: |
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For option B what I'm looking for there is filling dead air. Like waiting for repops. I don't think I would want all the same missions available all the time. So like, I'll give you six missions to start, and then if you start the gold one, completing it might make the ore mission become available. So you wouldnt be just spamming the ore mission until fully decked out. It would be a once-in-a-while thing. And its chance of success depend on having a crack team of fully leveled up pets. More common missions would be for lumber and maybe ones that are shit gold but great pet xp. Obviously we are polling so I have not put a whole fuckton of thought into that. |
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Ashlyn
Joined: 20 Oct 2006 Posts: 291
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Posted: Fri Apr 09, 2021 5:56 pm Post subject: |
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Just have a maximum per 24 hours missions like tasks. You can do 1 ore/gyvel/purple/gold mission per 24 hours. Have different pets have different success rates/reward rates and make putting the effort into raising pets worth it in your downtime. |
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Davairus Implementor
Joined: 16 Jan 2004 Posts: 10358 Location: 0x0000
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Posted: Fri Apr 09, 2021 6:14 pm Post subject: |
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We could do that but you have to remember. It is supposed to fill dead air. So if you are doing rounds of forest five or whatever, and are sleeping bored, locked out of all your missions by a 24 tick timer, it isnt going to be able to fulfill its purpose. I don't expect that to one to end up in just sitting in a guildhall spamming pet missions. It'll be a possibility, of course, but I think that is going to give you the feeling that you aren't making the best use of time. I think its more like, set your missions up (run up to 2 at a time, out of 6), anything worthwile will take 15 min to complete, something really nice may take over an hour. So if you're off ranking or Winter, or logging off, and know you arent paying attention then that's the time to initiate some really long missions. And five minutes stuff would be aimed at pet levelling.
It could also be like, reverse consumables, like you send a team of pets off on a mission to help blockade supply lines, and a cabal member gets a message the something is interfering with his shops, so defender potion is pricier atm. Again, imagination is the limit. |
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lionSpyre
Joined: 07 Sep 2015 Posts: 112
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Posted: Fri Apr 09, 2021 6:25 pm Post subject: |
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My suggestion would be to start with keeping things simple. Have it to where a pet can go collect x to y number of consumables. The number of consumables, the type of consumable, and the level / type of the pet determine how long the pet is gone for. Once it returns, you can send it out again. Because you can only summon one pet at a time, have it to where only one pet can go out on a mission at any given time. If this system works and people are happy with it, then slowly add layers of complexity (such as blockading, etc.).
On the subject of cool ideas though, what if rangers and druids (due to their affinity with beasts) can actually see these pets while their off on missions if they're in the same room? This way, if an enemy's pet is on a mission, the ranger/druid can disrupt supply lines. This at least feels very in-keeping with ranger strategy. |
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Ashlyn
Joined: 20 Oct 2006 Posts: 291
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Posted: Fri Apr 09, 2021 6:28 pm Post subject: |
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Rangers sending out panthers to murder your pets out on missions. I like it. |
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Kornhole
Joined: 15 Aug 2012 Posts: 373 Location: Melbourne, Florida
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Posted: Fri Apr 09, 2021 7:37 pm Post subject: |
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There was no box for bring back a good version of druid brew, so I didnt vote. If it becomes pet related I want an advantage on my chars with 5+ LVL 30 pets, just saying. |
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Davairus Implementor
Joined: 16 Jan 2004 Posts: 10358 Location: 0x0000
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Posted: Fri Apr 09, 2021 8:09 pm Post subject: |
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Whats wrong with brew? And yes to the second part. |
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Xerties
Joined: 24 Feb 2006 Posts: 484
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Posted: Fri Apr 09, 2021 8:58 pm Post subject: |
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I voted C, and here's why.
Controlling potion supply is a big part of combat for fighters. That's part of the tradeoff for having up to eight attacks per round. If you start making this stuff really easy to gather you're eating away at the balancing factors for the other classes. I already don't like the new 4 purple mob. If you can get your opponent to burn through their potions, then camping hobgoblins gives you a big advantage. If you want to give people an auto-consumable collector may as well just go the full monty and give everyone stance at level 40.
All that being said, my second choice would be A, because more stuff for lairs is always good. |
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Vevier Immortal
Joined: 23 Jul 2008 Posts: 1642 Location: everywhere
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Posted: Fri Apr 09, 2021 10:22 pm Post subject: |
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Out of all of these, it seems like A is the one that leads us less down the minecraft path we've been following lately. So that has my vote.
I don't want to see us slide down a slippery slope and end up picking out reed to weave our baskets with, which is where C would be heading. Even B just takes the 'tree punching' out of the equation and you still would have to do all the annoying crafting and inventory management that comes with such a system. I'm not opposed to seeing pets get more utility, but I would like to see it at least come with the cost of it needing to be the active pet so you couldn't have a different one out ranking with you. |
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Arunore
Joined: 05 Aug 2014 Posts: 200
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Posted: Fri Apr 09, 2021 10:44 pm Post subject: |
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I voted C.
My idea is wildly influenced by WoW, but I always thought they had a good system with professions. I'm not saying duplicate that, but maybe a mixture of A, B, and C at varying degrees.
A) LAIR USAGE - The mimic. Buy an extremely rare and difficult-to-get Mimic that goes in your lair and yields randomly generated materials once or twice daily. But.. it has some chance to turn on you and attack you.
B) FOLLOWERS - With enough reputation you can hire mercenaries to adventure and forage for materials, consumables, etc. Pets don't have thumbs so I don't think they should be bringing you anything.
C) MANUAL - Good 'ol DIY. Wield your pickaxe, hammer and pick at the ore node/vein to yield randomized results. Have rare nodes appear once in a blue moon that yield extravagant results. This is more work though, because then you might want to synchronize that with other professions. Like Skinning for Leathers. So the best way would be to go do it yourself. |
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BlackWidow
Joined: 24 Apr 2014 Posts: 476 Location: Yes
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Posted: Sat Apr 10, 2021 1:08 am Post subject: |
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I don't think that having pets gather materials is the solution. (ex) Valour nobility has a distinct advantage with their Noble pets which can become very beefy and difficult to kill (not to mention being able to carry more). I remember Snooze (Trelanya's triton/snake pet) had thousands of hit points at level 50 (granted, Snooze was a noncombatant, and it took a long time to raise him to that level). |
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Bladefury
BANNED
Joined: 11 Jun 2012 Posts: 520
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Posted: Sat Apr 10, 2021 5:24 pm Post subject: |
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Yea I dont like the idea of sending creatures to do it. I voted C. With herbs and stuff idk why people complain so much |
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Davairus Implementor
Joined: 16 Jan 2004 Posts: 10358 Location: 0x0000
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Posted: Sat Apr 10, 2021 10:11 pm Post subject: |
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Well its hard to respond to everybody at once with the way this thread format is, here is a bit if a firehose.
Xerties that mob is on a 1/20 chance to repop, it does not offer a significant extra amount. It was just supposed to be a "rare" mob that will occasionally be there as a lucky find. If nobody has been in the area to check for a while, its more likely to be there, and the affect of that is to incentivize checking the purples which means after a while PK'ing can collide at the large hobgobliin.
Kornhole I looked into brew and find some bugs. These are already fixed so druid brew is working again. it was not broken on purpose. I am going to update the herblore skill today as well.
Bladefury this thread is very relevant because we've recently talked about warriors creating field bandages. If you look at the Warlord shop, you literally just buy animal remains for cure blindness with your boss kills credit card. You don't actually kill tigers, you imagine a group of warlords went and did that and trade you for likewise effort. We similarly considered selling the field bandages at the juggernaut for medals, instead of farming cloth for it. How warlord fits into a consumables big picture is they use their medals and stance to avoid farm. They dont even have to learn where things are or how things work. They can sit AFK for 30 min and get medals to spend on it. I think we could just acknowledge we like that... for "the basics". It appeals because it frees up time to do something more fun without allowing hardcore to log on all day and pile up loads of supplies, and its also not buying pond water. Using one resource to buy another resource gets a bit weird, I know. Underlying everything though, time is the most precious of all resources. |
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Xerties
Joined: 24 Feb 2006 Posts: 484
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Posted: Sun Apr 11, 2021 6:57 am Post subject: |
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Ah, I didn't know the mob was a rare pop. That makes it a lot better. |
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Davairus Implementor
Joined: 16 Jan 2004 Posts: 10358 Location: 0x0000
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Posted: Wed Apr 14, 2021 7:25 am Post subject: |
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Made this yesterday based on our thread's ideas.
Code: |
Jewelry Store
You are inside the Jewelry Store. Large oil lamps mounted on the wall
illuminates the room brightly, with light reaching every corner of the
room. People gather here from all over the realm in search of the
perfect jewelry. A huge glass case made of brass with dragons carved
into its legs and sides lined with gold is here displaying various
rings, bracelets, necklaces, and earrings made of gold and silver, each
of them decorated with diamond, rubies, sapphires, and other exotic
gems. You can go on the Common Road to the north and a staircase near
the back of this room leads up to another room.
[Exits: north up]
A jewelcrafting station has been setup here.
Mire the jeweler is here polishing her display of exotic treasures.
list
[Lv Price Qty] Item
[25 10000g / 100c ?? ] a design for a pendant of protection 1 lb - made of unknown (pattern)
[ 1 3000g / 30c ?? ] a set of golden javelins 0.1 lb - made of gold (javelin)
[15 1800g / 18c ?? ] shiny bracer 3 lb - made of steel (wrist)
[30 6000g / 60c ?? ] gold bracelet 0.1 lb - made of gold (wrist)
[42 14000g / 140c ?? ] marked bracer 0.5 lb - made of leather (wrist)
[15 1800g / 18c ?? ] talon amulet 0.7 lb - made of claw (neck)
[30 6000g / 60c ?? ] evanescent amulet 0.6 lb - made of pearl (neck)
[42 14000g / 140c ?? ] eternity necklace 0.3 lb - made of diamond (neck)
[15 1800g / 18c ?? ] signet ring 0.1 lb - made of metal (ring)
[30 6000g / 60c ?? ] gemstone ring 0.1 lb - made of diamond (ring)
[42 14000g / 140c ?? ] wedding ring 0.1 lb - made of diamond (ring)
[ 1 1000g / 10c ?? ] a ring fixture 1 lb - made of bone (trash)
[ 1 1000g / 10c ?? ] a pendant setting 1 lb - made of bone (treasure)
> craft
Mire the jeweler says 'I offer to craft the following pieces of jewelry for you:'
Mire the jeweler says '[ 100] A crystal ring.'
Mire the jeweler says '[ 100] A blood pendant.'
Mire the jeweler says '[25 1250] a pendant of protection'
> craft protection
Mire the jeweler says 'It sounds like your request is to craft a pendant of protection.'
Mire the jeweler says 'This requires my fee of 1250 gold, and the additional materials:'
Mire the jeweler says '- 5 of a lavender and green stone.'
Mire the jeweler says '- 1 of a banded ring.'
Mire the jeweler says 'Place everything onto the jewelcrafting station and ask again when you have it all together.'
> put banded station
You put a banded ring on a jewelcrafting station.
You put a lavender and green stone on a jewelcrafting station.
You put a lavender and green stone on a jewelcrafting station.
You put a lavender and green stone on a jewelcrafting station.
You put a lavender and green stone on a jewelcrafting station.
You put a lavender and green stone on a jewelcrafting station.
> craft protection
Mire the jeweler works away and cheers happily, creating a pendant of protection!
You receive a pendant of protection.
> cast identify pendant
Object 'pendant protection' is type jewelry, material gold.
Extra flags: glow no_enchant.
Made to be worn on the neck.
Weight is 4 lbs, value is 1250, level is 25.
Modifies mana by 20.
Modifies save vs spell by 5.
Modifies constitution by -1.
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Let me know if I seem on the right track or if this just looks like a load of shit. |
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