Actually Bitchslapping Trash

1. dremil Actually Bitchslapping Trash -
   Sorry I didn't make that break in the log as big as i might've.. it was spammy and annoying.
2. Nadrin Actually Bitchslapping Trash -
   Still didn't seal the deal... lol
3. dremil Actually Bitchslapping Trash -
   lol this is true.
4. beia Actually Bitchslapping Trash -
   Chomryul is honestly complete trash. I have killed him on at least 5 different toons. You should level into the 50s and see how bad you get your shit pushed in.
   
   To be constructive.
   
   Try mastering things that you plan to use, like blindness. I thought it was a must for DK to master blindness.
5. Chomryul Actually Bitchslapping Trash -
   
   Level 1: magic missile 15 mana ( 1%)
   Level 3: chill touch 15 mana ( 1%)
   Level 4: blindness 15 mana (100%) detect magic 5 mana ( 82%)
   Level 5: detect good 5 mana ( 1%)
   
   you're a dumbfuck, and you probably are lying beia.
   
   
6. beia Actually Bitchslapping Trash -
   I guess you just suck :P I like busting your balls man don't go crying.
7. Chomryul Actually Bitchslapping Trash -
   But that's what they teach you in women's studies. You should express your grief and rage every time.
8. Beljia Actually Bitchslapping Trash -
   beia, Chomryul, quit being idiots on the log boards PLEASE. I don't like seeing these kinds of comments.
   
   beia, you're not exactly the best guy around, it's already been mentioned some of the shit you get into. In addition, you need to quit pissing people off both in and outside the game.
   
   Chomryul, your comments aren't any better.
   
   Have either of you noticed the newbies coming around? This is the kind of thing which will turn people off.
   
   
   
   
   ...and to the admins/mods at invokation, can you please remove these comments, maybe even this log and the ones above and below it?
9. Chomryul Actually Bitchslapping Trash -
   http://www.network54.com/Forum/109789/message/1050824523/The+cock+slap+of+a+dark-knight
   http://www.network54.com/Forum/109789/message/1050954591/Knights+truly+are+pathetic
   
   http://www.network54.com/Forum/8513/page-19
   
   
10. Chomryul Actually Bitchslapping Trash -
    Sure, we can keep it more pg. But I doubt absolute newbies find the logboards immediately.
    
    wait for them to become one of us.. one of us.. gooble gobble..
11. tyrzerz Actually Bitchslapping Trash -
    Only reason i play this mud is nostalgic as this is firts mud i played ever althou i wouldn't reccomend this one to newbies. There are more lotr fans or whats related to it i'd rather reccomend MUME to newbies cause there are sso many things logical than in this mud for example when ranger builds a campfire without a light your still have no vision in that room and theres many such unlogical features in this mud. It was much better at 2002 than now.
12. tyrzerz Actually Bitchslapping Trash -
    Only reason i play this mud is nostalgic as this is firts mud i played ever althou i wouldn't reccomend this one to newbies. There are more lotr fans or whats related to it i'd rather reccomend MUME to newbies cause there are sso many things logical than in this mud for example when ranger builds a campfire without a light your still have no vision in that room and theres many such unlogical features in this mud. It was much better at 2002 than now.
13. dremil Actually Bitchslapping Trash -
    Yeah, I agree with you that the flaming is out of control. Sure the log isn't a great one, but it was worth posting given the last one..
14. Etelaan Actually Bitchslapping Trash -
    Tyrz I could say the same about 2002 AR as well. It was pretty fun. However, There were a number of pretty ridiculous classes and skills. Weapons didn't even matter. In Dav's words, if you werent using a mace for maximum parry, you were fooling yourself. Combat modules, weapon rock paper scissors, and special abilities on spear and axe changed that a bit. im sure they envisioned, as I have, a game where someone can wield a 2 handed axe or sword or even a mace, and be just as viable as someone going sword and shield or mace and shield, for examples.
    
    Sometimes I wonder if AR hasn't become overly complicated. The simplicity of past AR meant it was easy to learn what exactly you did wrong. I think that they tried to implement the RPC weapon style in such a manner that when you get around the defense of a defender's parry, it's statistically the same as if you were fighting with those two weapons in the old AR model.
    
    
15. erlwith Actually Bitchslapping Trash -
    beljia starts off in the right direction then joins the idiots in the crapslinging contest.
    
    anyway AR, to quote dav, is the "thinking man's game" in that it isn't just the hack n slash you can find in other games. Get best gear, do right combo, your enemy loses 95% of the time. AR requires a lot of effort. is that for the good or the bad, well, lol has a gazillion people playing so you tell me. i think the complexity was burzuk's direction and the game has a new one now for sure.
    
    The biggest issue though is MISINFORMATION and the knowledge gap. As a new player, the help files are just the tip of the iceberg, some of them are even misleading or wrong. To really get any traction getting better you'll need to read the log boards, read the forums, search back to old posts where people are just commenting, etc. This is where the gold is, and you'll get all the little bits of information you won't find normally. if newbie players just had the wealth of knowledge vets do at their disposal I think they'd be more likely to player and get into the cabal scene.
    
    i don't even know where this post was supposed to go.
    
    
    
    
16. Etelaan Actually Bitchslapping Trash -
    Oh, definitely. I think there needs to be a critical mass of players willing to help newbies at any given time. I try to volunteer it in game, but I have less "pull", you might say, than someone with MYSTIC or OVERLORD by their name or whatever. I think there should be a Queue or pool you can join every time you log in, that says to new players "X is here to help you with questions".
    
    or I could just roll a mystic..
    
    I find bash to be a misleading or non-informative helpfile. It states that size and strength affect the "effectiveness" of bash, but it took a Fact or Myth Q&A on the forum to reveal that size affects damage and strength affects lag time (im guessing it's strength comparison from attacker to defender?).
17. Chomryul Actually Bitchslapping Trash -
    Alright then, I apologize.
    
    it just really pissed me off when he full looted my corpse and left me with nothing from our first interaction, and then I was handing him his ass all over thera, and then I lagged, and he should've figured I was lagging due to only moving 3 spaces every 5 seconds and trying to flee. And he Full looted me again.
    
    If a mod needs to clean up my posts, Im sorry for making them take the time to do that.
18. iolo Help Files -
    If you find problems in any of the help files, or think they need clarification, PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE log your requests in the "Bugs and Observations" forum on ar.com. If you don't log them there (or in-game with the new ISSUE command) then we won't see them and won't know what you think needs fixing.
19. Etelaan Actually Bitchslapping Trash -
    Or the imms could take notes whenever a question is brought up.
20. kapruski Actually Bitchslapping Trash -
    http://www.network54.com/Forum/8513/page-10
    
    There's some excellent flame wars they are delicious.
21. Nadrin Actually Bitchslapping Trash -
    What a dumbass response Etelaan. You really that selfish? The imms work for free. The imms spend THEIR time to make this game that we pay for free better. There are proper channels for this stuff for a reason. Do you really think the builders have the time to look through these logs all the time? This is NOT an AR official site. If you have looked at the forums, you post something on the bug forum nine times out of ten within a few days an imm will have posted on there that they stopped the project they were working on to take the time to FIX the issue that was brought to them. They aren't going to look at invokation and read through the flamefests to decide hey we need to look at that. Dumbass.
22. Etelaan Actually Bitchslapping Trash -
    Not at all. I've asked imms to clarify help files multiple times, but those helpfiles never get changed even after they explained what the help file meant. If someone is asking for clarity, maybe the help file needs to be changed?
    
    Spewing vitriol to ingratiate yourself with the imms doesn't actually help anything, naddy.
23. ergorion Actually Bitchslapping Trash -
    I agree with Nadrin. If you only asked for clarification and an imm gave you clarification, then your question was answered and you shouldn't bitch about the help file. If you asked to get the help file changed on the other hand, then you might have a point.
    
    I ask for clarification on stuff without expecting the help file to be changed. I just want to get a better sense of the nuances. We don't want to have all our help files read like War and Peace.
    
    Lesson? If you want something done, ask for that. Not something else that you think might possibly somewhat lead to what you want done.
24. Nadrin Actually Bitchslapping Trash -
    1. Imms don't check the logboard for tasks.
    2. Imms aren't clairvoyant.
    3. Imms aren't obligated to do things just because you ask them to.
    4. Follow proper channels and you WILL get an answer even if it is one you do not like.
    5. Nuff said.
25. retard Actually Bitchslapping Trash -
    Etelaan,
    
    We have a process to help ensure that things get done. It is difficult to keep track of things when they are only communicated verbally.
    
    As a reminder, you can use the command bug .
    This will open an issue ticket and the Imms will take care of your bug when time allows. You will be able to see your ticket as progress is made with the new ISSUE command. It is used in game and very convenient because it works just like a note.
    
    If your bug is too complex for one line, that's when you should use the forums.
    
    Please read the changes forums to keep up to speed with the updates the Imms are making. We would not have improved the bug submission process if we did not care about making these fixes, however the priority is up to us to decide. Please help us by communicating how severe your bugs are - for example, typos are things we like to fix but it gets fixed when we have time for it. If someone had a game-crashing bug we would take care of it immediately.
26. retard Actually Bitchslapping Trash -
    Also, we would type up all the bugs, but we think you'd rather us spend the time fixing them. We actually have began keeping a log of bugs that we fix and find, but that only started about 2 months ago. If you have already raised the bug anyway you might as well just use bug and save us that time.
27. oxyl Selfish much etlann -
    also, retard is Davairus and iolo is Ceridwel. So you've got two diff Imms tryin to help you here. Show some thanks.
28. Etelaan Actually Bitchslapping Trash -
    Well, look at you guys, all foaming at the mouth and such. If it IS a bug, and an immortal hears about it directly from a mort who "tells" them about it, I'd think the imm would write it down. If it's a help file that isn't clear, and people keep asking questions about the help file, I think immortals would write it down and see if it needs revision.
    
    nowhere have I said "I dont wanna report, they should just KNOW what the bug is and fix it without my interaction". This is undoubtedly what oxyl and nadrin are assuming, and we all know what use assumptions are, right guys?
    
    I've reported bugs, both on forums and directly to imms. A few serious ones were addressed on the spot. However, when asking for clarification on a help file, Im suggested to put a Bug and Observation into the forum so they can look at it, even though I'm speaking directly with an imm who should be able to bring it to attention of the staff on their own.
    
    Im happy to let staff know of a problem, but Im not happy that when I discuss a quality control issue, Im the one called selfish. Why don't you go see how far that attitude takes you in the real world with your managers.
29. Nadrin Actually Bitchslapping Trash -
    Etelaan
    Reply: Or the imms could take notes whenever a question is brought up.
    
    Your words, not mine. Even when the imms DO take notes, that doesnt mean that the imm in question is able to fix the issue, or will do so without approval etc. When an imm is working on something the things that are in the proper channels get priority.
30. Etelaan Actually Bitchslapping Trash -
    now the imms cant talk to each other or have an established protocol of information sharing?
    
    Keep digging.
31. Nadrin Actually Bitchslapping Trash -
    You treat this like it is a business. Its not. The imms work on their time, for free. They have lives, they have jobs, some of them are students on top of that or have children to spend time with etc. Bottom line is, You ask them to do something in game, they may or may not be too busy to even take note of it. Answering a question is one thing. A busy imm is not going to drop everything to do things your way. They do have an established protocol of information sharing. Just like they have an established protocol for listing bugs or asking immortals questions to enhance that. Use it and stop bitching.
32. Etelaan Actually Bitchslapping Trash -
    People with jobs have lives too. People have hobbies too. It's obviously not a business, but they are the ones with the control over the thing. It's their baby. Noone is asking them to do it their way, but they're not using all possible resources available to them. That's their choice and Im not going to change how they want to do things. The one bitching here is you.
33. erlwith Actually Bitchslapping Trash -
    The point Nadrin is failing to make is that this OUR Game. We should all want to help each other out to make it an even better game. The imms take care of it, so do we. They do more work than us for the most part, and have more access and control, but we as mortals still have a responsibility to cultivate the game like anyone else. Imms, Dav, Olyn and Vanisse specifically already have a ton to do. They don't get to play and enjoy the game for hours and hours on end so that WE CAN. So, essentially, the least we can do is document bugs, and bad help files so that they can fix it when they get a chance.
    
    This isn't to say imms don't fix helpfiles on their own without player input, I'm sure they do. There's just so many in my opinion that are a little inaccurate or behind the times or missing important information, that they'd spend forever just catching the HELP files up and spend no time making the game more awesome and more fun with new features. Now do I think the lower level imms have the time to sift through the help files?? YES I DO. However the potential worries me when I have lower level imms * constantly* feeding me bad info. Even Vanisse has given me bad information at times. That goes to the point that it is difficult for people (especially players) other than Dav to really know if a helpfile is wrong or not. But we can still pass the information along, regardless if we're wrong or right.
    
    Bottom line is, you can report a helpfile in about 10 seconds. note to immortal;note subject help file; note + line x is wrong in HELP aaaaa;note send. Vanisse has gotten back to me in as little as a few minutes, and usually no longer than a day about it.
    
34. Etelaan Actually Bitchslapping Trash -
    when I build effect pedals for my hobby, I keep a pad of paper to record any pertinent hints or tips I come across. I don't do that for anyone else but myself, to do the best I can at my hobby. Everything I record can only help me and my hobby. I've never said players don't have to do anything even if they really don't. I have posted bugs and other game issues and even spelling corrections to the forums. The thing I have a hard time wrapping my head around is a person who is an imm and doing this game support as a hobby not having a piece of paper to scribble a note on before going back to doing what they were doing. If that sounds like dropping everything to please only me, Nadrin, you are a very immature person.
    
    In a thread of AR myths, bash was sussed as strength affects lag time and size affects damage and that was a while ago. If it wasn't clear to players, someone would want to go check the help file against the answered myth to see why people weren't understanding it and update it, right?
    
    =1. Imms don't check the logboard for tasks.
    =2. Imms aren't clairvoyant.
    =3. Imms aren't obligated to do things just because you ask them to.
    =4. Follow proper channels and you WILL get an answer even if it is one you do not like.
    =5. Nuff said.
    
    1 is fair, signal to noise is bad on a log board.
    2 is meaningless. you don't need to be clairvoyant to see an issue and hunt it down.
    3 obviously. they're free to run it how they want and do as much or as little as they like since it is their game after all, erlwith, and we get to play.
    4 obvious statement.
    5 you're so clever.
    
    Maybe some of the imms just feel burnt out, but can't admit to it. They still really like this game and want it to succeed, as I think we all do. Perhaps my thinking is a bit too stringent for their tastes. They are free to work in whatever manner is least stressful and most fun for them. a hobby shouldnt be a burden or stress.
    
    I'd like to thank all of the posts of angst for forcing me to spell it out. It was really productive for everyone.
35. Nadrin Amusing Etelaan -
    Message From: Etelaan
    Subject: I take it
    Message:
    you've never had a successful hobby in your life, since you approve of half assing something that you're doing for yourself.
    
    are you poor too? lololol... please. Get out. You're an immature fool. If a person has a passion and drive for a hobby they pursue it, and if they
    really enjoy it they make sure to do their best job in their hobby. You know why? Because they have only the incentive to do the best they can. Maybe
    if they're like you they will ignore relevant information and build a birdcage from a sand rail kit, wondering why they cant drive it anywhere, but
    most people who are interested in a hobby keep learning more about it and dont miss a scrap of information that might be helpful to them.
    
    Kiss ass some more. Maybe you'll find gold.
    
36. xenyar Actually Bitchslapping Trash -
    Pip, lock this thread please.
37. retard Actually Bitchslapping Trash -
    I can understand some ignorance and maybe butthurt because the bug command I brought up was only added to the game less than a month ago. Its been very successful.
    
    Use the bug command. You have to type only one line. It even records the room you were in.
    
    
    If you don't want to or know about the bug command, and just tell an imm, its fine, we'll use the bug command ourselves, it only takes one line of typing for us too. However, if you just pray, it could be that nobody hears you. Also it is the same amount of effort, you just type 'bug' instead of 'pray' or 'tell olyn', and the rest is the same.
    
    FYI, my desktop is covered in text files of things I scribbled down, so much that I can't find it anymore. That is why I finally added an issue tracker, not just for my own use, but for everybody on the staff to use. There are currently 61 entered issues and 32 of those have been closed, since I implemented it.
    
    
    Thanks for caring about the game enough to vent all that about it, but I'm afraid you've definitely jumped the gun on this. This game is continuously improving.
38. Etelaan Actually Bitchslapping Trash -
    my only real annoyance was at the reactionary clowns doing their tricks because I criticized what is something that really looks like a glaring flaw perhaps only to me because I asked about it in game, searched high and low on the forum, and realized it has been a help file that doesn't seem to have been made clearer for a number of years, if people still have questions about it. I really just wanted to put the peanut gallery back in their place, because we all know you guys are doing a good job and striving for improving AR.
    
    I went to 3 ring binders with dividers after excess notepads made things imposible to find. Could always have folders going from general to specific areas, but I actually find a folder containing paper faster and easier to find information with, even if both are cataloged well.